39 replies to this topic

[Nolonar]

First, examining Ibusuki's secret gender. It doesn't make sense to me that Ibusuki would pretend to be male just so that she wouldn't have to see images of herself over boys. Seems like it would actually be a useful skill to know who likes you are not. On the other hand as a fake male she has to deal with the demon zombies, seems those are much worse then seeing the zombies as yourself.

 

Imagine meeting a random fat old man on the streets. You don't know him, and he probably doesn't know you. Above his head there's a first-love-zombie of yourself, in string bikini, bound by ropes and gagged, with their crotch constantly hovering in front of the guy's face.

I don't know about you, but I'd be pretty disgusted as a man. I believe a woman would feel similarly disgusted. Or are you saying women are actually shameless and wouldn't even bat an eyelash? How sexist of you.
But then again, you're surprised that she's not using this skill of hers to toy with people's hearts, as any other bitch would. In other words, you either automatically assumed that Ibusuki is a bitch (for some unknown reason), or that all females are bitches.

Chapter 8 already explained Ibusuki's situation pretty well. As soon as she realized what she saw weren't ghosts, she was relieved and accepted the zombies. As she and her surroundings grew older, she started seeing zombies of herself in increasingly revealing clothes. That's when she decided to transfer to another school as a boy this time.

 

So she is pretending to be male and pretending to hate Taro when she actually wants "to be her true self" AKA female and is in love with Taro. I suppose she could be in denial about the love.

 

She doesn't pretend to hate him. She's just furious, because he head-butted her instead of giving her a farewell kiss, which is why she has to see all sorts of disgusting sexual fantasies men can have about her, forcing her to dress as a man against her will.
It's not denial, it's resentment.

 

Grandma wants to reveal her secret so she can have a real daughter, since if she is male, that makes her a different person and more of a disappointment to grandma.

 

Grandma explained this in chapter 27.
When Ibusuki came back to Japan, grandma was shocked to see how dark and cold Ibusuki's eyes had become, which is why she wanted her granddaughter to be back to her usual cheerful self. She probably assumed that Ibusuki's new persona is linked to her emotional distress, which is why she wants to reveal her secret, so she can be freed of whatever burdens her.
 

 

Grandpa wants to hand down leadership of the family business to her, but only if she is a pretend male. Like its inconceivable to give the family business over to a known female. Like being a heir is a macho thing, a sign of being male, as if she accepted said inheritance, it would be like accepting to pretend to be male for the rest of her life.

 

Because authors cannot possibly add stereotypical old men with traditional and conservative world views without being traditional and/or conservative themselves?

 

Besides, the story takes place in Japan, what did you expect?

What's next? "The author is against individuality, because most characters are in uniform"?
 

 

Like she couldn't be herself, have the same relationship with grandma, and be a heir to the family business, no matter what gender role she was playing. Say if she were to reject gender roles altogether, where would she be left in all this nonsense?

 

The entire succession plot made up 3 chapters out of nearly 60. It's NOT what this story is about.

This manga is about romance, not gender identity crisis.

 

 

All this to me is the author saying Ibusuki's identity is her gender. That would be why she she is mad with Taro, that she felt she had to mess up her identity in order to avoid seeing versions of herself over boys heads.

 

Your logic makes even less sense here.

 

It's not because she's angry with Tarou that she decided to pretend being a boy. It's the other way around.

​It's because she has to pretend being a boy, that she's angry with Tarou.
 

 

I dislike all this nonsense. It could have been done much better. Very shallow story telling and character fleshing.

 

I also dislike all this nonsense. You could have done so much better. Very shallow reading and character understanding.
Try again.

[VxXxV]

I remembered my 1 on 1 lesson with female religion techer on high school, its about adam and eve creation and how God create different body for male and female.

Then she asks of how specific job is more suited to certain gender. The expression on her face when i said dancer for female is certainly intriguing.

[pothb]

Tumblr Demons!!!! aahhh!!!!

[truepurple]

I will read http://vatoto.com/comic/_/comics/himegoto-juukyuusai-no-seifuku-r6925and see. Meanwhile I will judge things based on their own. But a few points.

 

 

Every indication that the grampa will not pass on the family business if she re embraces a female identity. That the reason he wants her as a male is to pass on the family business.

 

Bashlis: I dont see that grandpa wants to hand down everything because of gender role, i feel like its because she told everyone to refer to her as he, and grandpa figured after so long she wants to be referred to as he for now on. I figured hes getting impatient and just wants a successor so he can retire without worrying about the families future.

 

It's funny how you contradict your first sentence with your second.

 

So the other three factors are the grandma, black twintails girl, and IIbusuki herself. I take it some of you are arguing that with the first two, it's about what they think would make Iibuski  happy. I don't believe that tracks with the hamfisted actions of the grandma that shows so much disregard for Iibuskis feelings, only stopping short of just telling people openly and risking alienating Iibuski. But let's set that aside.

 

What is making Ibusuki happy or sad?

 

Consider chapter 66, page 19. http://vatoto.com/reader#0acbf2131528b776_19

Two aspects come to mind on this.

 

What the hell does her pretending to be male have to do with her not having friends? She could have male friends, she could have female friends. There are male/female friendships, nothing stopping her from hanging out with and befriending other females at the same time as she is pretending to be male.

 

If it is really hurting her to pretend to be male, it really begs the question why she is still doing it. Yes, yes, she doesn't want males imagining her in sexual ways, seeing that above their heads. So just put on bad makeup and otherwise have a unsexual appearance that will make guys not fall for her. Besides, as she gets older, surely more and more guys will already have "first love zombies" and thus she doesn't have to worry about that with them. And even if it is bothersome to see yourself above other peoples heads, that doesn't at all compare to not having friends or what ever supposed harm she is suffering from not dressing in a dress or whatever.  Also only a few more perverted fellows imagine the more sexual stuff most of the time from what we've seen.

 

This also begs the question, what about homosexuals? Certainly she would encounter some homsexuals in her life, as a "pretty boy", wouldn't "he" possibly become a zombie for some of them? Likewise, we have yet to see any males floating above other males heads. And also, what about females first love zombies? Is the author saying there is something special with male love that females don't have? Or is female created "first love zombies" that they simply can't see? I find this second one unlikely. There would have been some interaction/clue to this by now.

Edited by truepurple, 26 March 2017 - 07:33 AM.

[Adimiss]

Spoiler

I will read http://vatoto.com/comic/_/comics/himegoto-juukyuusai-no-seifuku-r6925and see. Meanwhile I will judge things based on their own. But a few points.

 

 

Every indication that the grampa will not pass on the family business if she re embraces a female identity. That the reason he wants her as a male is to pass on the family business.

 

 

It's funny how you contradict your first sentence with your second.

 

So the other three factors are the grandma, black twintails girl, and IIbusuki herself. I take it some of you are arguing that with the first two, it's about what they think would make Iibuski  happy. I don't believe that tracks with the hamfisted actions of the grandma that shows so much disregard for Iibuskis feelings, only stopping short of just telling people openly and risking alienating Iibuski. But let's set that aside.

 

What is making Ibusuki happy or sad?

 

Consider chapter 66, page 19. http://vatoto.com/reader#0acbf2131528b776_19

Two aspects come to mind on this.

 

What the hell does her pretending to be male have to do with her not having friends? She could have male friends, she could have female friends. There are male/female friendships, nothing stopping her from hanging out with and befriending other females at the same time as she is pretending to be male.

 

If it is really hurting her to pretend to be male, it really begs the question why she is still doing it. Yes, yes, she doesn't want males imagining her in sexual ways, seeing that above their heads. So just put on bad makeup and otherwise have a unsexual appearance that will make guys not fall for her. Besides, as she gets older, surely more and more guys will already have "first love zombies" and thus she doesn't have to worry about that with them. And even if it is bothersome to see yourself above other peoples heads, that doesn't at all compare to not having friends or what ever supposed harm she is suffering from not dressing in a dress or whatever.  Also only a few more perverted fellows imagine the more sexual stuff most of the time from what we've seen.

 

This also begs the question, what about homosexuals? Certainly she would encounter some homsexuals in her life, as a "pretty boy", wouldn't "he" possibly become a zombie for some of them? Likewise, we have yet to see any males floating above other males heads. And also, what about females first love zombies? Is the author saying there is something special with male love that females don't have? Or is female created "first love zombies" that they simply can't see? I find this second one unlikely. There would have been some interaction/clue to this by now.

nearly a year later and another social justice course under the belt we're back for round 2!

 

Go push your agenda somewhere else tumblrtard.

[truepurple]

Adimiss, you're just trolling, and know nothing about me. For the record, I am no "SJW" and have never used tumbler, or even heard of it till it was mentioned in a forum on this website. It's your failing that you can't comprehend my points and feel you must reduce me to some stereotype in your mind to more easily dismiss me.

[truepurple]

While I don't share your religious values, I get that you're trying to promote tolerance.  Careful not to assume this author's personal stance though: Minenami Ryo-sensei also writes the most anti-gender-role manga series I've ever read (Himegoto).  Hatsukoi Zombie isn't as openly provocative as Himegoto but the main themes here are still tolerant friendship and affection crossing boundaries.  Himegoto is far more serious while this is a comedy, but the author shows a lot of similar values.

 

I read Himegoto to chapter 11 and skipped through latter chapters, it is nothing like  anti-gender role. Its all about people boxed into gender roles.  I see very little difference between Ibusuki' and the MC of Himegoto aside from the racier and more serious aspects of it. In fact, Hiimegoto is good evidence for the author believing in gender roles, or at least struggling with them. Everyones in various roles and oscillating between them. 'Am I this? Am I that?' at no point does anyone just be themselves and forget the roles, they can't, the thought doesn't even seem to ever occur to them, even though it would solve most of their problems.

 

I am not trying to promote anything. I am saying, hey, look, there is another way to view this issue that isn't discussed much by anyone. Which is, people should like what they like and forget about demographic etc."identities".

Edited by truepurple, 29 March 2017 - 12:11 AM.

[sjp]

I read Himegoto to chapter 11 and skipped through latter chapters, it is nothing like  anti-gender role. Its all about people boxed into gender roles.  I see very little difference between Ibusuki' and the MC of Himegoto aside from the racier and more serious aspects of it. In fact, Hiimegoto is good evidence for the author believing in gender roles, or at least struggling with them. Everyones in various roles and oscillating between them. 'Am I this? Am I that?' at no point does anyone just be themselves and forget the roles, they can't, the thought doesn't even seem to ever occur to them, even though it would solve most of their problems.

 

I am not trying to promote anything. I am saying, hey, look, there is another way to view this issue that isn't discussed much by anyone. Which is, people should like what they like and forget about demographic etc."identities".

 

"good evidence for the author believing in gender roles, or at least struggling with them"

 

This is a non-statement. Like, of course the author believes in gender roles, everybody in society has to experience that concept!

 

I don't really disagree with the spirit of your thread, but your points are really asinine and you don't seem to have a strong grasp of the ideas you are talking about. You don't understand how to talk about art/media either.

 

"Everyones in various roles and oscillating between them. 'Am I this? Am I that?' at no point does anyone just be themselves and forget the roles, they can't, the thought doesn't even seem to ever occur to them, even though it would solve most of their problems."

 

This? This is on the tier of "Why doesn't Dumbledore just kill Voldemort?". The answer is, the story would end without any exploration of the mangaka's ideas (Or salary).

 

People who Write About Art don't ask inane questions or try to fix a plot. You need to try harder.

[truepurple]

Both with HK and Himegoto a fair amount of the plot revolves around gender identity.  Both lead females question whether they are truly female, or male.

 

This is especially true of Himegoto, which has the weirdest, most garbled nonsensical base plot issue ever (or at least top of the list) which at its base is all gender identity. So she's wearing jeans because her friend expects her to be maleish, even though he knows she's female, not only does she desire to wear a dress, it gets her off sexually somehow (what?!??). She's suffering in the heat wearing jeans (is the author saying shorts don't exist in japan?!? And jeans of all pant types to wear during a hot summer. I suppose it could be worse, could be sweatpants)  all because she doesn't want to disappoint one person who thinks of her as a male personality. From what I read, this person doesn't even feature much and disappears altogether in latter chapters I skipped to, so it's not even someone she's all that attached to, who she's wearing stuff that makes her miserable for.  And she's like, 'Am I male and want to date this female prostitute person? (who also forces sexual stuff on her) Or am I female and want to date this future male rapist? The "mangaka's ideas" is that of a strong belief in gender identity, so yeah, take away that and the story would end, at least in Himegoto.

 

How much of Harry potter would change if Harry or Dumbledore was female, or identified as female, or were females that identified as males?  Almost none of it, as long as they didn't make a thing of it.  Change any of the characters genders or "gender identity" and Harry Potter would really be pretty much almost exactly the same. Also, Dumbledore wants to kill Voldemort, it's just not that easy, they have to get the Horcruks and destroy them first, and they have to find Vold and physically defeat him after that. And if you mean when Dumbledore first met him and saved him from the orphanage and brought him into the wizarding world, obviously Dumbledore didn't know he would become super evil. So your point is weird/bogus, you talk like you haven't even seen/read Harry Potter, yet you are using it to make a point.

 

If in Harry Potter there was a giant "Defeat Voldimort for good" button smack dab in the middle of school for anyone to press, no let's say every room in the school had such a button, no every wizard carried around such a button, and they all would work, if you press any of the buttons, you would defeat Voldimort for good, yet no one pressed the button ever, no matter how bad things got; that would be a huge issue with the plot, don't you agree?

 

Himego especially, and to a much lesser extent HK, it feels exactly like that. In Himego, she could just wear what she wants, talk like she wants, show interest in the things she likes, and be sexually attracted to who strikes her libido, and tell on anyone who sexually assaults her, because that's not cool.  Yes, the plot would fall apart, just like the plot would fall apart if someone pressed that button in Harry Potter, but it's a stupid plot to be like that in the first place.

 

With HK, it's very similar with Ibusuki, she carries around a button called, "just be yourself and forget about gender identity" and she never presses it, even though it would solve most of her problems. Most of the males she knows already have zombies, and if she dress's plainly or unattractively, even if she tells people she has female parts, it's unlikely anyone will make her the model for their first lust zombie. And if it's concern over not wanting to face her feelings with the MC, she could just pretend to be a cross dressing male, and just "cross dress" on  a regular bases, if she wants to.

 

Instead the story goes out of its way to make gender identity a center piece issue. In chapter 71, as she said, she is going to be a female, pretending to be a male, playing the role of a male pretending to be a female. And obviously none of the other plots would fall apart if you took away this silly subplot. How much more centered on gender identity can you get than that?!? How much more evidence do you need that the author strongly believes in gender identities defining us? For heavens sake, the author is even saying she can't make friends because her gender identity is off or some stupid shit!

Edited by truepurple, 29 March 2017 - 10:41 PM.

[sjp]

You are proposing solutions as if these characters are real people who need their problems solved. They aren't, they are a part of a story. Your suggestions to improve non-existent lives are irrelevant.

 

Nobody has any real response to your posts because all you're saying is that you don't like the plot. Like, okay, stop reading then?

[truepurple]

Yes, Sjp. But there is a balance, a tipping point, between stuff you ignore just because it's a story, and stuff that's hard to ignore. Similar to suspension of disbelief point.  Like if you were watching a movie and someone  jumped off a building on earth and fell up with no explanation at all, that would be well beyond typical suspension of disbelief point of the average person. Similarly if you are watching a car chase scene in a non-comedy, and suddenly the vehicle being chased by those who would do them harm suddenly stopped and set up for selling food out the side, that would be beyond most peoples suspension of disbelief regarding rational behavior of a character in a story, one that you can't just brush off with "It's just a story, it's not real"

 

Clearly someone not having friends because they are pretending to be male because <insert faulty reasoning> falls on a much different part of the spectrum for me then it does for others. For me, both her decision of pretending, and not having friends because of it, are well beyond my suspension of disbelief regarding decisions of a character and how the world works in the story.

 

Besides, there is nothing wrong with criticizing a story, there are other aspects of the plot I do like. Helping others with the clues provided by first lust zombies makes for interesting story. Though they'd have alot more material if everyone had first lust zombies, not just males (and it seems to be saying something that only males have them) I  wish that it was love, not lust, that spawned the zombies though.The MC and his desire both to do little work but also desire to help others and to try to resolve troublesome first lust zombies is a interesting aspect of it. The complication of possible love between both two humans and a human and the supernatural outcome of the lust between the two humans is a very interesting aspect of the story. I am only discussing Himegoto because it was wrongly used as proof for the authors viewpoints on gender identity.

 

Also, I wanted to discuss this aspect of gender identity independent of the comic, having a rather fresh and interesting perspective to share about it.

Edited by truepurple, 30 March 2017 - 03:38 AM.

[sjp]

You're also just plain misreading things because it's pretty simple why Ibusuki pretends to a man. She was forced to see sexualized images of herself in grade school, and being 10 years old or whatever, couldn't handle it. The zombies as an idea are pretty messed up to begin with, but Ibusuki had to witness all these weird catatonic sex slave version of herself being puppeteered by her classmates.

 

Ibusuki isn't friendless because she cross-dresses, she withdrew from people after essentially being molested. After being traumatized, she switched schools and hid her real identity, and that's not the sort of situation that helps you make friends.

 

It would bother me greatly if my acquaintances started bringing mannequins of me around and dressing them up in fetish gear and tying them up.

[truepurple]

The younger she was, the younger they would be, and the less sexualized the first lust zombies would be. From what I remember of that chapter where she was introduced to the class as a girl and she saw FLZ of herself appear, they were all very tame.

 

It would bother me greatly if my acquaintances started bringing mannequins of me around and dressing them up in fetish gear and tying them up.

 

Most of the first lust zombies they see on a regular bases are just wearing less with bigger busts. Not sex slaves. Not being puppeteered by anyone, how could they, when they can't even see them/don't even know they exist .(and if they could see them, the FLZ get free will and not be puppets either) Only one character has been shown with more disturbing FLZ on occassion because of his sexual fantasies, someone she met after she switched to pretending to be male. So your statement is not remotely based on the comic, just something you pulled out of your ass.

 

FLZ's can only be made once, only the first. Meaning as she gets older, there will be less and less people to turn her into their first. And as the comic shows it, just about everyone her age already has a FLZ <-- Point already made earlier..

 

She is not so amazing that just by knowing that she's females everyone without  a FLZ will be wanting her no matter how she looks or acts. <---Point already made earlier.

 

Besides, pretending to be male, she could still get FLZ of herself. From someone whos homosexual, or even just someone who sees her and likes what he sees, even "knowing" she's a male.

 She doesn't walk around with a sign saying she's a male. Someone might just assume she is a cross dressing/"tom boy"(stupid word/concept but convenient to this point)  female before "learning" she's male. It's lust at first sight, that means before introductions sometimes. Especially if you argue she is so amazing looking that everyone will immediately lust after her upon seeing her if they know she's female, some of that would carry over where it's unclear too.

 

Ibusuki isn't friendless because she cross-dresses, she withdrew from people after essentially being molested

 

That is such a absurd SJW/new wave feminism statement. A male flirting with a woman isn't raping her. There is no "rape culture" in western or "first world" countries. Her seeing images of herself over peoples heads (even fetish ones) isn't anything close to "essentially being molested". Stop making victims that aren't.

 

After being traumatized

 

Again, too strong of a word.

 

she switched schools

 

People make new friends after they switch schools, you know.
 

and hid her real identity

 

No, they all know she is Ibusuki, her personality is there for all to see, more so if she opens up to people, they know her age and nationality, they know her given name and can find out about her family easily enough. Her gender is not who she is, she is who she is. And she is not a spy putting on a act to keep a cover, or a super hero, so no, she did not "hide her real identity".  Way to miss completely the main point I've been making throughout this thread.

 

and that's not the sort of situation that helps you make friends.

 

What exactly is stopping her from making friends?

Edited by truepurple, 30 March 2017 - 09:37 PM.

[sjp]

If you took photos of a child, photoshopped their clothing off, and then forced them to look at your sexual fantasies regarding them, that is 100% molestation. What's happening here is the same thing, just without a deliberate perpetrator. That doesn't actually change anything for Ibusuki, she doesn't want to see other people's sexual fantasies 24/7.

 

This has nothing to do with flirting or rape culture either, I don't know why you brought it up.

 

 

You write a lot, but you're too preoccupied with nitpicking sentence fragments to form a coherent argument. Can you write some bullet points, and cut out the verbal diarrhea?

 

"What exactly is stopping her from making friends?"

 

Ibusuki is unhappy and withdrawn because she was seeing disturbing images. Her parents have broken up their marriage because she told her father about the zombies. She is, at the very least, having vivid hallucinations at all times. You don't seem to understand that Ibusuki is not happy with her situation, do you have difficult understanding other people's emotions?

Edited by sjp, 30 March 2017 - 11:20 PM.

[truepurple]

If you took photos of a child, photoshopped their clothing off, and then forced them to look at your sexual fantasies regarding them, that is 100% molestation. What's happening here is the same thing, just without a deliberate perpetrator. That doesn't actually change anything for Ibusuki, she doesn't want to see other people's sexual fantasies 24/7.

 

That is a bogus statement on a number of levels. From all indications, she was not seeing herself naked, she was not seeing sexual fantasies of herself, (most of the time, with most people, anyway) especially not as a child. If she was seeing herself naked, never heard of a mirror? She knows no one else can see them, so it would be the same as looking at yourself in a mirror in the privacy of your own room. But the FLZ do not normally appear naked.

 

  Lack of a perpetrator, not even a accidental one, makes a huge difference. It's the difference of someone exercising power over you, or not. "she doesn't want to see other people's sexual fantasies 24/7." You just get more and more hyperbolas, this is a extremely false statement.  And by even your bogus most extreme hyperbolas words, the definition of molest, does not fit at all http://www.dictionary.com/browse/molest

 

This has nothing to do with flirting or rape culture either, I don't know why you brought it up.

 

Because both new wave feminines calling all sorts of stuff rape that isn't, and talking about "rape culture" and you using the word "molest" have the hyper hyperbolas victim creating.

 

You didn't answer what exactly is stopping her from making friends, insulting my EQ is not a answer. The comic specifically says because she is pretending to be male, how do you rationalize that?

 

You write a lot, but you're too preoccupied with nitpicking sentence fragments to form a coherent argument. Can you write some bullet points, and cut out the verbal diarrhea?

 

Geez, rude asshole. I have given coherent bullet point arguments, both originally and as a response to your various comments. How about you give a coherent argument, you are all over the place, if I am all over the place, it is only because I am taking my time to respond to what you are saying.

Edited by truepurple, 30 March 2017 - 11:58 PM.

[sjp]

That is a bogus statement on a number of levels. From all indications, she was not seeing herself naked, she was not seeing sexual fantasies of herself, (most of the time, with most people, anyway) especially not as a child. If she was seeing herself naked, never heard of a mirror? She knows no one else can see them, so it would be the same as looking at yourself in a mirror in the privacy of your own room. But the FLZ do not normally appear naked.

 

  Lack of a perpetrator, not even a accidental one, makes a huge difference. It's the difference of someone exercising power over you, or not. "she doesn't want to see other people's sexual fantasies 24/7." You just get more and more hyperbolas, this is a extremely false statement.  And by even your bogus most extreme hyperbolas words, the definition of molest, does not fit at all http://www.dictionary.com/browse/molest

 

The zombies are explicitly sexual fantasies. Ibusuki decided to switch schools and cross-dress right after seeing a classmate's fantasy of her (as a 12-year-old) in a string bikini.

 

There is obviously no word in the English language that would describe what is happening in Hatsukoi Zombie (The author made up the concept, eh?). Looking in the dictionary for one is stupid.

 

In any case, Ibusuki is an unwilling witness to sexualized images, some of them herself. Ibusuki does not want to be in that situation. She cross-dresses to avoid seeing herself pop up as another zombie, but it doesn't stop her from seeing them everywhere.

 

What YOU would do in the same situation doesn't matter, because you are not a manga character.

 

 

Because both new wave feminines calling all sorts of stuff rape that isn't, and talking about "rape culture" and you using the word "molest" have the hyper hyperbolas victim creating.

 

You didn't answer what exactly is stopping her from making friends, insulting my EQ is not a answer. The comic specifically says because she is pretending to be male, how do you rationalize that?

 

You are bringing in your own mental baggage as if I should care about what you think about SJWs. It has nothing to do with this argument.

 

I explained very clearly why Ibusuki stopped making friends, she is very unhappy about her life and doesn't have any way to fix it.

 

Again, what YOU would do in the same situation is irrelevant.

 

You quoted sentence fragments and type paragraphs in "response" to each of them. That's annoying and pointless.

Edited by sjp, 31 March 2017 - 01:18 AM.

[truepurple]

So why not call it rape then? Hey, we could even call it genocide. If you struggle to find the right word for something, that doesn't mean you can use any word you like.

[sjp]

So why not call it rape then? Hey, we could even call it genocide. If you struggle to find the right word for something, that doesn't mean you can use any word you like.

Is this really all you have to say?

 

Ibusuki is the unwilling witness of explicitly sexualized material. I described the situation as "essentially molested", in place of a much longer, irrelevant description of events. You must be aware that we are talking about the same comic right? Does this nitpicky nonsense actually matter to you argument, or are you simply fixated on "being right"?

 

Your argument by the way, hinges entirely on the fact that you don't understand why Ibusuki is cross-dressing. I "insulted your EQ" by asking if you have problems understanding other people's emotions, but I'm quite positive that it's just the case. Grow up and realize that people think differently from you.

 

Personally, Ibusuki's actions, tsundere-schtick notwithstanding, have been perfectly understandable.

[truepurple]

You criticized me for responding to everything you said, so for you to say "is that all you have to say"...

 

It's obvious you have a very dishonest way of arguing. For example

 

Your argument by the way, hinges entirely on the fact that you don't understand why Ibusuki is cross-dressing.

 

No, I argued there isn't a reason for Ibusukii to pretend to be male. And no,  my main point doesn't hinge on that either. Either you can't see the sea change difference in meaning because you lack the intelligence, or you do, but don't care because of your dishonest way of arguing.

 

Regarding the term "molest". It's no more nitpicking than saying you shouldn't call a car accident, a genocide. You grossly exaggerate things and twist them like a true new wave feminist SJW. What words you use matter, you should be ever so slightly careful with which ones you use.

 

I don't remember her seeing herself in a bikini as a little kid, but even little kids have seen people in public in bikinis, even other little kids, even themselves in mirrors.

Edited by truepurple, 01 April 2017 - 12:19 PM.

[truepurple]

Here is a comic where characters "cross dress" yet no issues with gender identity. http://vatoto.com/comic/_/comics/otonari-complex-r16976

Or http://vatoto.com/comic/_/comics/tomo-chan-wa-onna-no-ko-r15722, is very "masculine" by most standards, yet doesn't hide that she is female, same with her mother. Though Otonari is a better example of more open concepts of gender identity.

I would point out that Ibusukii pretending to be male means she is going to be put with males any time there is gender segregation, like bathrooms, shower rooms, sleeping rooms on field trips. All the more chance for someone to notice how female her body is, despite 'being male', and develop a FLZ of her, or to develope a FLZ of her because of her masculinity or whatever. More she's around males thanks to pretending to be one, especially in more 'intimate' settings, more chance of someone developing a FLZ of her, talk about backfiring.

Edited by truepurple, 01 April 2017 - 04:51 PM.