9 replies to this topic

[God Ginrai]

So, I have run across a lot of manga on this site that are missing chunks of chapters. Sometimes this is due to not all of them being uploaded, but most times it is due to the scanlators of the manga having a no upload policy. I understand and respect this, however I believe that Batoto can do something to make this easier for the readers of such mangas without violating the policy of the scanlators.

Right now, the only way that I have seen that people have used to inform people of a no upload policy are the comments section or the actual manga description. I propose instead offering the ability to "post chapters" that are instead details and links.

I'll use this manga for example: http://www.batoto.ne...uriiro-na-r3807

As you can see, people are currently being told through a comment (which could be pushed down if lots of people talk about the manga) that the chapters 4-8 cannot be uploaded due to a no upload policy. With my idea, you could choose to add a description that shows up in the correct position in the chapters section where the chapters it concerns would normally show up. Just like normal chapters, the title would be the chapter, the group would be whoever scanlated it, and so forth. However, there would be an inset under the title that had a message about the no upload policy and to go to the scanlator's website by clicking the title. That way, by clicking the Chapter like you normally would when you intend to read it, you would be directed to the scanlator's website so you could go about getting the chapters from them. The most important thing about this is that people wouldn't go "Where are the first 20 chapters of so-and-so manga???" and instead would know where to go to continue or begin reading the manga.

-God Ginrai

[penguin71]

It sounds like a good idea. But one of the problems is that many of the "no-upload" groups are inactive. Disbanded. Defunct. That is, they no longer have a site to link to. The only way we know that their group doesn't allow it is because when we go to upload, there's a not in the manga stating "don't upload". Linking to active groups could be effective, but that would require monitoring the activity/status of every group that uploads. For example, if a group changes sites/hosts/disbands then the links would no longer work. I think your idea could be implemented, but it work probably only work sporadically, and require constant checkups.

Regular fans of series can easily find the chapters of a manga they like by visiting mangaupdates, finding the group that scanlated those chapters, then paying visit to their site directly, or in case the site is out, checking out mangatraders for the chapters. I don't understand why they comment on where chapters are when they can check instantly on mangaupdates. Yes, it is tedious, but very possible. After all, we contributors and other uploaders have done if for quite a while now.

Honestly, I like the idea of linking to the scanlator site itself, but it seems like something that only would work if all scanlator groups were extant and steady.

Edited by penguin71, 27 February 2012 - 03:30 AM.

[God Ginrai]

It sounds like a good idea. But one of the problems is that many of the "no-upload" groups are inactive. Disbanded. Defunct. That is, they no longer have a site to link to. The only way we know that their group doesn't allow it is because when we go to upload, there's a not in the manga stating "don't upload". Linking to active groups could be effective, but that would require monitoring the activity/status of every group that uploads. For example, if a group changes sites/hosts/disbands then the links would no longer work. I think your idea could be implemented, but it work probably only work sporadically, and require constant checkups.

Regular fans of series can easily find the chapters of a manga they like by visiting mangaupdates, finding the group that scanlated those chapters, then paying visit to their site directly, or in case the site is out, checking out mangatraders for the chapters. I don't understand why they comment on where chapters are when they can check instantly on mangaupdates. Yes, it is tedious, but very possible. After all, we contributors and other uploaders have done if for quite a while now.

Honestly, I like the idea of linking to the scanlator site itself, but it seems like something that only would work if all scanlator groups were extant and steady.

While the link is a good thing, the main point of this suggestion is to tell the users why the chapters are not on Batoto and what they could do to find the chapters. The link idea was an extra. Basically, if they have a site you can link to, then include it, if not, oh well.

Also, I'm not suggesting that Batoto has people constantly monitoring for No upload policies and then putting messages into effected manga. This is meant to be a better way for the people who would normally edit the description or add a comment to inform people of the no upload policy to inform Batoto readers about said policy.

On a side note: Of course you can check mangaupdates. You can also check mangaupdates to find out about updates to manga, and yet how many people still seem to want RSS? You shouldn't approach these kinds of suggestions with the thought "Well you can just do this instead" but rather with the question "Would this be helpful?"

-God Ginrai

Edited by God Ginrai, 27 February 2012 - 07:42 AM.

[Grumpy]

I don't really envision this to be something Batoto would purvey. This is what mangaupdates is for.

[God Ginrai]

I don't really envision this to be something Batoto would purvey. This is what mangaupdates is for.

It's true that Mangaupdates can do this, but don't you already have features that Mangaupdates has anyway to make it easier for the user? (Ratings, Description, Genres, etc.) I feel that this specific feature would help to smooth out the user experience where such circumstances (no upload policies, etc.) occur.

-God Ginrai

Edited by God Ginrai, 27 February 2012 - 09:53 PM.

[mhh]

If we implemented that everybody would deny us the right to host since we would directly link to their chapters.

Batoto is an online reader not an "online referer".

[Kalladin]

I just realized, if you put links "referring to an outside site" even if it's the scanalator, you can lose batoto's message. It will just become a site for convenience. And if you have a site that just have links, you forget about what those links really mean, because convenience will overshadow meaning.

I'm suggesting that those links represent the scanalator's hard work and how you can give thanks to the people who bring the manga manhwa manhua to you.

For example, mangafox = convenience. It had a big meaning maybe 3-4 years ago. It would respect scanalator's policies and was fan run for the most part. Now it's just an aggregate site which is a convenient place to go to read manga. And this practice has been handed down and used in other site models.

I think manga was sortof freedom of the internet message (back then). Now it's become a little twisted.

Edited by Kalladin, 02 March 2012 - 02:09 AM.

[God Ginrai]

If we implemented that everybody would deny us the right to host since we would directly link to their chapters.

Batoto is an online reader not an "online referer".

I never said to post direct links to direct downloads. But to post links to the scanlator. You could even make it so that the link automatically links to whatever is set to the Homepage for the scanlator in the scanlator's group information. And once again, the link itself was not the point about my suggestion and can be thrown out if deemed inadmissable. The feature I want implemented is the message that lets users know that there is a reason that said chapters can not be hosted on Batoto, and which scanlator to look for to find the chapters themselves.

I just realized, if you put links "referring to an outside site" even if it's the scanalator, you can lose batoto's message. It will just become a site for convenience. And if you have a site that just have links, you forget about what those links really mean, because convenience will overshadow meaning.

I'm suggesting that those links represent the scanalator's hard work and how you can give thanks to the people who bring the manga manhwa manhua to you.

For example, mangafox = convenience. It had a big meaning maybe 3-4 years ago. It would respect scanalator's policies and was fan run for the most part. Now it's just an aggregate site which is a convenient place to go to read manga. And this practice has been handed down and used in other site models.

I think manga was sortof freedom of the internet message (back then). Now it's become a little twisted.

MangaFox didn't really ever fully respect scanlator's policies. They just respected certain ones to make a show out of being "caring." Convenience isn't bad, so long as it is implemented correctly. Think of it this way: The easier this site is for manga readers to use, the more that will use this site instead of MangaFox. The more that use this site instead of MangaFox, the more that are supporting the ad system for the scanlators just by browsing Batoto. Telling a user "hey, if you can't find it here, why not try here?" should be a non-issue, because it encourages people to come to your site instead of leaving you for MangaFox because they know you'll tell them where to find it if you do not have it. And by sending them to the scanlators themselves when you can't host it, you are getting people to visit the scanlators and download their manga there. Isn't that what most scanlators would rather people do than read on aggregators? (It seems to me like most say "If you must read from a website, then at least use Batoto")

-God Ginrai

Edited by God Ginrai, 02 March 2012 - 02:25 AM.

[Grumpy]

I believe what mhh is saying is that it rewards the people who disallow uploading on Batoto which may result in an unwanted repercussions. As "nice" as we want to be, positions which may be self-destructive wouldn't be ideal.

[God Ginrai]

I believe what mhh is saying is that it rewards the people who disallow uploading on Batoto which may result in an unwanted repercussions. As "nice" as we want to be, positions which may be self-destructive wouldn't be ideal.

I think I see what you're saying. That's a shame, tho'. It seems like a no win situation for the reader, then, on this issue. :\

-God Ginrai

Edited by God Ginrai, 02 March 2012 - 09:09 AM.