Dungeon ni Deai wo Motomeru no wa Machigatte Iru Darou ka Gaiden - Sword Oratoria

God damn it, Bete.  And God damn it, Japan.  What is wrong with being a back-row character?  It's like those characters cannot possibly respect someone who can't do karate or whatever.

 

The last main character whom I remember fighting a war while not knowing how to fight was Houshin Engi's Taikoubou, and that was in the 90s.  Is it really such a sin not being able to wave a sword around?  I know I shouldn't feel offended by this, but as someone who played mostly mages on D&D, I feel like I just had my play style invalidated...

Suicide Bombers, huh? Well, we know which God is behind them now. 

I guess the random plot armor from Bell just bothers me a bit.

 

I mean, i get it, he wishes to be a hero, and thats exaclty what heroes do. They make the impossible come true. They usually have some secret ace in the hole to turn the tables around when it seems totally impossible to do so. Specially in shounen, were willpower, friendship and trust usually translate into physical power.

 

But at some point in the story, you NEED to stop making Bell get a random, timely power up that saves the day, and instead make him win the fight with skill, strategy, and wits.

 

Sure there have been a few "timely miracles" here too, but i guess i can let it slide it if it happens once or twice.

But i think your series has a problem when its MC ability is to just "win".

 

If put everything in term of online game.

 

"random, timely power up that saves the day" = a near dead passive buff with short duration, and lost after battle.

 

But in Bell's case it more like booster

He have special events (for only him) that boost over 100% EXP/status earn.

He get Aiz as mentor that boost all status to max.

He get limited edition weapon that as get stronger as you grow (double his max cap status of lvl 1 => he strong as max cap status of lvl 2).

He get limited edition book that teach skill not from his class (he have a mage sub class with premium item)

With his will power (don't want look un-cool in front of Aiz again) He risk his life to fight the Rank up quest Boss and kill it.

 

Bell is just a naive newbie player "make him win the fight with skill, strategy, and wits." is hard. All he can do is fight head on with his over limit status, his guts and his skill. What a Power Hero always do. (Tanker Solo Top, fight to dead with enemy and be a meat shield for his comrade.)

He is too naive and straight forward to have wits. (Mid lane, fast to realize enemy movement and use Ping effective)

Only pro player keep battle over and over know how to judge enemy power, know that he can't solo it head on, know enemy weakness to think of strategy. (read enemy movement and plan ahead of time, lead everyone to ambush enemy)

Argonaut is actually the Dei ex Machina skill, if you really think about it.

 

But yeah, eventually they have to tone down his MCness a bit

 

Not really. Most adventurers have skills that work all the time or can be used multiple times in a row. His requires a charge in order to achieve full power and he's borderline exhausted after that anyway. In a real fight if the enemy doesn't immediately die or dodges it, he's fucked.

 

Meanwhile other adventurers have shit like temporary speed or strength increase, passives that grant higher crit chance and so on.

well, there are 3 things what help Bell win against Minotaorus.

 

1. the first skill he got, if you remember that's skill help Bell improve and level up him stats quickly. Bell train with Aiz-chan(monster lvl 6) for a week and he got all stats in rank S/SS. Max . noone in lvl 1 have the stats in Rank S/SS.

 

2. The Dagger Hestia (loli godness) gif him. a Dagger made for a craft's godness.

 

3. the Magic book help bell to get magic. "Firebolt"

 

if you think he won by miracle, well maybe yes, but he have the merit to win too,  because  all he got before fight to Minotaour.

 

Argonaut is actually the Dei ex Machina skill, if you really think about it.

 

But yeah, eventually they have to tone down his MCness a bit

I guess the random plot armor from Bell just bothers me a bit.

 

I mean, i get it, he wishes to be a hero, and thats exaclty what heroes do. They make the impossible come true. They usually have some secret ace in the hole to turn the tables around when it seems totally impossible to do so. Specially in shounen, were willpower, friendship and trust usually translate into physical power.

 

But at some point in the story, you NEED to stop making Bell get a random, timely power up that saves the day, and instead make him win the fight with skill, strategy, and wits.

 

Sure there have been a few "timely miracles" here too, but i guess i can let it slide it if it happens once or twice.

But i think your series has a problem when its MC ability is to just "win".

well, there are 3 things what help Bell win against Minotaorus.

 

1. the first skill he got, if you remember that's skill help Bell improve and level up him stats quickly. Bell train with Aiz-chan(monster lvl 6) for a week and he got all stats in rank S/SS. Max . noone in lvl 1 have the stats in Rank S/SS.

 

2. The Dagger Hestia (loli godness) gif him. a Dagger made for a craft's godness.

 

3. the Magic book help bell to get magic. "Firebolt"

 

if you think he won by miracle, well maybe yes, but he have the merit to win too,  because  all he got before fight to Minotaour.

It looks like they could use some agent orange in v6 c22.

He won against the Minotaur because by that point he was already strong enough to fight it but what was holding him back was his own trauma from his previous encounter with one at the start of the story. 

Yeah and did he use any Deus Ex Machina from hell power  or whatever protagonist plot shield? And it wasn't an easy fight either, it was the same kind of fight as the last one where Ais lvled.

I'm sorry but how did he win agaisn't the minotauro?

He won against the Minotaur because by that point he was already strong enough to fight it but what was holding him back was his own trauma from his previous encounter with one at the start of the story. 

Damn this is like the dark side of danmachi but i still like it

I guess the random plot armor from Bell just bothers me a bit.

 

I mean, i get it, he wishes to be a hero, and thats exaclty what heroes do. They make the impossible come true. They usually have some secret ace in the hole to turn the tables around when it seems totally impossible to do so. Specially in shounen, were willpower, friendship and trust usually translate into physical power.

 

But at some point in the story, you NEED to stop making Bell get a random, timely power up that saves the day, and instead make him win the fight with skill, strategy, and wits.

 

Sure there have been a few "timely miracles" here too, but i guess i can let it slide it if it happens once or twice.

But i think your series has a problem when its MC ability is to just "win".

I'm sorry but how did he win agaisn't the minotauro?

I guess the random plot armor from Bell just bothers me a bit.

 

I mean, i get it, he wishes to be a hero, and thats exaclty what heroes do. They make the impossible come true. They usually have some secret ace in the hole to turn the tables around when it seems totally impossible to do so. Specially in shounen, were willpower, friendship and trust usually translate into physical power.

 

But at some point in the story, you NEED to stop making Bell get a random, timely power up that saves the day, and instead make him win the fight with skill, strategy, and wits.

 

Sure there have been a few "timely miracles" here too, but i guess i can let it slide it if it happens once or twice.

But i think your series has a problem when its MC ability is to just "win".

A bit biased here aren't we? Not all seinen are superior to shounen you know. There's a lot seinen who only relies on edgy behaviour, copious amount of blood and gore and wish fulfilment while completely ignoring what is truly essential to a story, namely character development, strong plot, interesting setting, believable character and nice chemistry between character. Stories like HxH, FMA, yu yu hakusho, samurai x, BnHA are all very good shounen and suprass many seinen by a wide margin. And this coming from a huge seinen fan

I said usually not always. As for the "biased" part if you take a look at our groups project list it will prove that I/we are not biased at all.

Nah it's not just him.... This IS a lot better than the main story. I mean that one is targeting kids while this one is seinen. Usually for me ( while I read both shonen and seinen) that means that the content is far better. And don't get me wrong my group is doing both manga but this has a far better story and story development.

A bit biased here aren't we? Not all seinen are superior to shounen you know. There's a lot seinen who only relies on edgy behaviour, copious amount of blood and gore and wish fulfilment while completely ignoring what is truly essential to a story, namely character development, strong plot, interesting setting, believable character and nice chemistry between character. Stories like HxH, FMA, yu yu hakusho, samurai x, BnHA are all very good shounen and suprass many seinen by a wide margin. And this coming from a huge seinen fan

It's just you, I guess?
 
I mean, "deaths, betrayals, (...), and a kind of every-man-for-himself environment" is not necessarily better than "friendship power, sugar and flowers".  You may like it better, but that's just a matter of taste.  Somebody else may like the main series better and think this is crap, and usually without a proper reason for either.

Nah it's not just him.... This IS a lot better than the main story. I mean that one is targeting kids while this one is seinen. Usually for me ( while I read both shonen and seinen) that means that the content is far better. And don't get me wrong my group is doing both manga but this has a far better story and story development.

Is it just me or is this A LOT better than the main series?

 

I mean, everybody here is an acomplished adventurer already, so the plot is kinda darker and more mature, or something.

We see deaths, betrayals, aizu being cool, schemes, weird conspiracies, more betrayals, more aizu, and a kind of every-man-for-himself environment.

 

Totally unlike Bell´s story, thats full of friendship power, sugar and flowers.

 

It's just you, I guess?

 

I mean, "deaths, betrayals, (...), and a kind of every-man-for-himself environment" is not necessarily better than "friendship power, sugar and flowers".  You may like it better, but that's just a matter of taste.  Somebody else may like the main series better and think this is crap, and usually without a proper reason for either.

Does anybody has a high res of Aiz status? I m trying to read it but I can only get two sentences.

/me facepalms .... Can a mod please delete the extra ch 21 that was uploaded?

Based one time.

Oh god, chapters 1 through 6 at the very least need proofreading. Dunno about the ones afterwards yet.

ANIME IS COMING!!

 

Is it just me or is this A LOT better than the main series?

 

I mean, everybody here is an acomplished adventurer already, so the plot is kinda darker and more mature, or something.

We see deaths, betrayals, aizu being cool, schemes, weird conspiracies, more betrayals, more aizu, and a kind of every-man-for-himself environment.

 

Totally unlike Bell´s story, thats full of friendship power, sugar and flowers.

Uh... because that's the point? Did you forget the title of the series or something? Not that I'm against the content you are praising, but there is a reason why the main series has so much "Harem Light Novel" content. If this series existed by itself, it wouldn't have prospered in the same way. It was spawned as an antithesis to the basic tropes embodied by Bell. Bell isn't supposed to lose too much of himself and as such the friendship power etc. is extremely strong so as to give him a sort of ledge or else he risks becoming vengeful and deviating from the fantasy-world harem MC stereotype a bit too much. Also again, the title. Under normal circumstances, you cannot fit comedy into a situation where you are drenched with the blood of a terrifying monster that traumatized you, but you can in this context because it is a Light Novel and the mature plot-line always comes secondary to the romcom shenanigans.

Amen brother. AizxBell are preferred, but as long as Freya gets her ass handed to herself i'm good. 

What? No love for Kami-sama? Is it because of her boobs? That's not her fault!

Is it just me or is this A LOT better than the main series?

 

I mean, everybody here is an acomplished adventurer already, so the plot is kinda darker and more mature, or something.

We see deaths, betrayals, aizu being cool, schemes, weird conspiracies, more betrayals, more aizu, and a kind of every-man-for-himself environment.

 

Totally unlike Bell´s story, thats full of friendship power, sugar and flowers.

I think I like the art better too

The best part of this series is the super cute and funny faces everyone makes.