30 replies to this topic

[MrFeatherFang]

I find this manga very interesting, especially the main protaganist. Also the art is great too.
I didn't want to put this in the comments section, so I made this.

I have a feeling that Masaki did not kill Kazuya because he was a virgin, I dunno. I feel like this page:
http://vatoto.com/read/_/123613/ore-ga-doutei-wo-sutetara-shinu-ken-ni-tsuite_ch2_by_prozess/2

has something to do with it. If Kazuya is a lowly salary man, what the heck is he doing at this party? Why is that woman he was with going to greet the authors? Isn't Masaki a novelist? I feel like there is more to this, but I must wait for more chapters! Thanks PROzess, take your time. You seem to be working on a lot of stuff.

[lonko]

The woman he was with is probably Soutome, which is a novelist too (but better than Masaki) and that's probably how Kazuya ended up at that party.

[Temper]

The woman he was with is probably Soutome, which is a novelist too (but better than Masaki) and that's probably how Kazuya ended up at that party.

Makes sense since Soutome knows her stuff about novels.
Also this manga is amazing thanks PROzess for this

[cry_nevermore]

personally, i think the reason the protagonist was killed didn't have so much to do with being good with girls so much as being charismatic in general, always gathering people around him and making them smile, while the friend is always shown in a corner by himself, watching his best friend drift away and leave him alone forever.
if that's the way it is though, i can still see the protagonist getting killed in the end if he doesn't manage his friendships better. i hope not though, that would make for one awful realization as you're re-strangled to death.

[oliverwashere]

If he dies when he loses his virginity, does that mean that he ... with pipes?

[svines85]

Great new chapter, so he was able to effect the past, but then he gets thrown back into the future? I wonder what his life is like now and if he's still destined to be murdered by his old friend or not like he was before all this happened.

[Blue Flaming Wings]

I also agree that the motive isn't as simple as Tanaka Masaki being jealous either because of Ichijo Kazuya's success with women or because Kazuya himself is being taken away from him (if you buy into the yaoi yandere theory). Personally, I think Masaki is just a good friend and what makes him snap is not because of Kazuya's success with women in general, but with one in particular, Yoshino Rika. While Kazuya doesn't have any memories of sleeping with her, it is entirely possible that she just changed drastically from her high school days so he didn't recognize her. To make the betrayal stronger, perhaps she was even dating Masaki at the time when she cheated on him (possibly from intoxication, like how the whole mess started) and then after that their relationship fell apart.

While it may not be something as specific as that, I feel in order for Masaki's motive to truly make sense it has to be something significant - an actual betrayal, regardless of whether or not Kazuya realized what he did.

[svines85]

Wow, things just keep getting more complex, don't they? So far it's quite an interesting look at "cause and effect"..........it also looks like the "big picture" is starting to really mess with his mind. It seemed like he's now doubting whether even if he changes the past whether it will really effect the future.

[svines85]

Ah geez, all that effort and he's still dead meat. >_<

I just wonder if our MC will ever consider the possibility of his friend being unfixable.........that his own future can't change because his friend is destined to go nuts and obsess over him no matter what actions he takes.

Edited by svines85, 03 March 2013 - 01:41 AM.

[Liar]

I think it shows how highly he thinks of his friend if he thinks he can prevent those sort of things from happening. He seems to genuinely care for him.

[Nest]

Why i can't feel a single positive feeling for the protag.
It seems lots of you guys forgot, that Kazuya only able to socialize and being charismatic is thanks to his adult knowledge. His normal self is a guy who can't even stand a proper talk to a girl or sometimes rude to them, just like Masaki who feel awkward talking to a girl

That said, i have a suspicion that Masaki also time jump to past (maybe he suicide after killing Kazuya, or he simply time jump like that, who knows), and it seems he's going to make sure Kazuya is not going to screw someone (especially Yoshino) in wrong way. Thus explain his expression in many scene, which is IMO not possible if he doesn't have his adult memory of Kazuya being an asshole who toy with girls feelings and then proceed making a particular someone suffer (high chance is Yoshino).

Then again it's all just an assumption, because you know... insane expression like that from simple jealous feeling is just... weird. Though, still need an actual story from Masaki's side (Which probably at the end of the manga) because we still don't know what is he actually thinking. Is it : "Bastard Kazuya why you getting all chatty with Yoshino" or "Don't you ever dare to make her suffer or i'll kill you on spot"

[svines85]

I think it shows how highly he thinks of his friend if he thinks he can prevent those sort of things from happening. He seems to genuinely care for him.

true, that's certainly one way to look at how things are progressing.

Why i can't feel a single positive feeling for the protag.
It seems lots of you guys forgot, that Kazuya only able to socialize and being charismatic is thanks to his adult knowledge. His normal self is a guy who can't even stand a proper talk to a girl or sometimes rude to them, just like Masaki who feel awkward talking to a girl

That said, i have a suspicion that Masaki also time jump to past (maybe he suicide after killing Kazuya, or he simply time jump like that, who knows), and it seems he's going to make sure Kazuya is not going to screw someone (especially Yoshino) in wrong way. Thus explain his expression in many scene, which is IMO not possible if he doesn't have his adult memory of Kazuya being an asshole who toy with girls feelings and then proceed making a particular someone suffer (high chance is Yoshino).

Then again it's all just an assumption, because you know... insane expression like that from simple jealous feeling is just... weird. Though, still need an actual story from Masaki's side (Which probably at the end of the manga) because we still don't know what is he actually thinking. Is it : "Bastard Kazuya why you getting all chatty with Yoshino" or "Don't you ever dare to make her suffer or i'll kill you on spot"

Well, I'm not sure about anyone else, but I haven't forgotten anything about this story or the MC, I mean it's only on chapter eight. The MC most definitely isn't a sympathetic character, even he knows that much. He's been presented as a pretty scummy individual from the start looking at the "real" time line.

And as far as him only being able to socialize because of the time skip, no, not the way I've read it, he and his friend weren't alike at all in that regard. That's why our MC started getting a bunch of tail as he got older...........according to our killer, after they were sophomores, right about now in other words. The "current" time is when he started turning into a thoughtless, uncaring player who grew apart from his friend according to our MC's memories.

A jerk who was cold, indifferent and even outright rude to his female classmates......and his later female acquaintances? Oh yeah, we've been shown that for sure..........but unable to socialize and un-charismatic? No, we haven't been shown that, I really don't think that was the case at all. After all, lots of women dig jerks, that's at least partially the point the author has been making.

Edited by svines85, 03 March 2013 - 06:10 AM.

[Nest]

@svines85
Okay that is understandable and acceptable.

And as far as him only being able to socialize because of the time skip, no, not the way I've read it, he and his friend weren't alike at all in that regard. That's why our MC started getting a bunch of tail as he got older...........according to our killer, after they were sophomores, right about now in other words. The "current" time is when he started turning into a thoughtless, uncaring player who grew apart from his friend according to our MC's memories.

IMO That's because he got beaten to a pulp by Mitsuru for having sex with Reiko, and also because of Reiko's reaction at that time. A turning point, or something like that, which Masaki does not have.

Also Masaki should grow a pair of balls and start taking initiative before Kazuya unknowingly grab all of her flag, lol.

[svines85]

IMO That's because he got beaten to a pulp by Mitsuru for having sex with Reiko, and also because of Reiko's reaction at that time. A turning point, or something like that, which Masaki does not have.

Well, I certainly can't say I disagree with you in that it might well have influenced him. A good butt-kicking along with getting stabbed in the back by your partner up to that point would probably embitter anyone. Though I'd point out the fact that he hopped in the sack with a friend's old lady in the first place............that in itself doesn't exactly scream "great character" to begin with.

Also Masaki should grow a pair of balls and start taking initiative before Kazuya unknowingly grab all of her flag, lol.

Again, no disagreement on that. Though I've got to say, that's partly what I was thinking about in my previous post (#9). Our MC may well not be able to make enough changes to prevent his future murder..........not if the root of the problem lies in Masaki's persona. If Masaki is a born loser who no amount of "help" is going to fix and is destined to become bitter, resentful and murderous towards someone or something............well then, our MC is just spinning his wheels with his current approach. Or at least that's the thought that went through my mind looking at the last panel of chapter 8.

[Similar-man]

Again, no disagreement on that. Though I've got to say, that's partly what I was thinking about in my previous post (#9). Our MC may well not be able to make enough changes to prevent his future murder..........not if the root of the problem lies in Masaki's persona. If Masaki is a born loser who no amount of "help" is going to fix and is destined to become bitter, resentful and murderous towards someone or something............well then, our MC is just spinning his wheels with his current approach. Or at least that's the thought that went through my mind looking at the last panel of chapter 8.

I've gotta say, that Masaki is starting to piss me off. We know that he does have at least a little balls since he willingly went to invite the girl himself. It's true that he invited her as representative of the group, but still, if he had no balls, was in love with her and felt awkward around her it should have been at least a bit difficult, but it really doesn't look like so. The whole purpose of the thing was in him being with the girl at that party, so why would he fake being asleep and give such a cold murdering glare to the mc?

I guess he could have been woken up by them and learned that she had a boyfriend and be shocked, but it looks to me like all his hatred and frustration is directed against the mc. And he's started being the kind of characters that frustrate me because of their passivity. I know not everyone is able to be direct about their feelings( I'm not ) but when it involves such deep hatred toward one of your best friends, to not speak at least to them is really annoying. If you can't be honest with your friends, then you don't really consider them friends IMO.

Thinking about it, Masaki has had his death-glares ever since the first chap, even before the whole time switch thing and he also talked once about a story where whatever you do, whatever choices you make, you end up in a tragedy. I feel like he is the kind of guy that always keeps his thoughts to himself and end up never really changing inside because of it. He doesn't let his true self confront with reality, so even him doesn't really know if he is a good or a bad person( not that you can actually think of it as a black or white thing but it's an example based on nothing but my reflection so ). That's why in the future he's still the same, he never really moved on, and you still don't know exactly why he did what he did.


Tl;Dr: I think that might be the whole point of the story, whatever the mc does, this guy's life will always be a tragedy, and may the mc become an asshole worthy of hatred or an awesome person worthy of jealousy, Masaki will always fixate on him, loathe him, and will kill him at some point.

Edited by Sighing, 03 March 2013 - 07:18 PM.

[svines85]

@Sighing

Yeah, that might just be what happens. Masaki (so far) seems like he may well be the type of person who does everything he can to invite misfortune, and then holds a grudge about it. I'm not saying it's intentional, could well be subconsciously or just his own bad luck combined with the weakness of character to not be able to shrug off the bad stuff..........but a guy who falls asleep at a party and then (looks like) gets pissed about someone talking to the girl he secretly likes............that's his problem and no one else's. An internal thing on his part, there's not much any outsider can do to help him.

[Liar]

I'm still sympathetic towards Masaki, but this recent chapter nearly changed that.

Anyway, I like the main character. He seems to realise a few times his second time around, and I think he's becoming a better person because of it. He saw the effects of how different things turn out to be if he had chosen differently. All I want from this guy now is to find some happiness. He's definitely different from the scumbag he used to be as an adult even if that change had started out of self-preservation.

Edited by Liar, 04 March 2013 - 04:30 PM.

[svines85]

I'm still sympathetic towards Masaki, but this recent chapter nearly changed that.

Anyway, I like the main character. He seems to realise a few times his second time around, and I think he's becoming a better person because of it. He saw the effects of how different things turn out to be if he had chosen differently. All I want from this guy now is to find some happiness. He's definitely different from the scumbag he used to be as an adult even if that change had started out of self-preservation.

Agreed totally, our MC has already made such changes in his early life to really put into question that he'll ever be the same person we've seen in his recovered memories. To me that's the most worrying thing about it all (Masaki). But yeah, I also definitely agree that just this chapter alone is not enough to change Masaki from being a sympathetic character............that one, last panel looks ominous, but still, it is just one panel and we don't yet know how he's going to react from here on out.

[svines85]

Wow, it's been a little while since we've seen some of our MC's antics from his previous life, but that flashback he had on pages 15-16............jeez, what an incredible cad he was. That was incredibly cruel.......especially given how I interpreted the circumstances of the setting  (in light of how he'd earlier described the relationship he'd had with her in his first go 'round). 

[elektron00]

The protagonist has always been an asshole eversince he became a playboy, so no surprise on that.

 

And now of all time, he's started to feel about his deeds when he was still in his adult form, which can still make him redeemable.

 

I like Nest's theory about what's going on in the plot, it's makes the most sense for now.