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[Spoilers until the dawn of time] Tower of God leaked Chapters Part 2


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#41
AquaTama

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B4 that Arlen thing i thought that Zahard had took the crest from an Axis from outside...Since an Axis is pretty much a god that would mean that he proclaimed himself as a god...But now i'm not really sure...


Edited by AquaTama, 03 April 2017 - 05:27 PM.


#42
mazino100

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Unless Zahard took that emblem from someone else. That's certainly an option.

yea maybe that the sumbole of the god of outside


Edited by mazino100, 03 April 2017 - 05:39 PM.


#43
Prince of Zahard

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When did SIU say that only one of the warriors opened the door? Anyway, if it's only one it's definitely Zahard. GoG didn't compare him Baam to him for nothing. Zahard lost his way because he didn't find his true self, he chose the demon unlike Baam.

 

 

Find a paradise where everyone can be happy.

 

The God of Guardian's memory was altered - thus everything that GoG said about Zahard could be altered. My personal theory is that everything the GoG said about Zahard was about V, and that's why the GoG is so confused about how Zahard changed so much. He didn't change - the memories he has were about V but the one who he sees now had a totally different goal to V. Also, I think the reason why Zahard's symbol is in the cave is because that's also the symbol of V - Zahard is using that symbol now but it was originally V's. If Viole is the Prince of Zahard, and V is Viole's father, then V could also be a Zahard. V seems like a first name while Zahard seems like a second name, so I predict that V and Zahard are brothers - they are both Zahards. The eye of Zahard is therefore a symbol of both V and Zahard, and Viole can be the true Prince of Zahard since he's the son of the True King, V.

 

And here's proof that GoG's memory was altered:

TOWCpCog.jpg


Edited by Prince of Zahard, 03 April 2017 - 06:44 PM.


#44
Malok

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I thought that there is no real "king" of the Tower.

It's just a title Zahard invented for himself after he decided to "rule" Floors 1-134. Which, for all we know, may not even be 1% of the actual number of Floors.

 

But even if you are right succession rules, historically speaking, are rather fluid.

There have been too many cases where the siblings of the deceased ruler have had equal, maybe even greater, claim to all relevant titles and lands than the ruler's children.

So, Zahard may just as well be the "true king".



#45
naphack

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Spoiler

 

That's an intriguing theory.

But that opens up a lot more questions: Which information can ultimately be trusted when the records were tampered with?


Edited by naphack, 03 April 2017 - 07:32 PM.

US RANDOM LEECHERS HAVE NO RIGHT TO COMPLAIN!


You don't scanlate, you don't complain, as simple as that.


#46
GreatBlackDragon

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The God of Guardian's memory was altered - thus everything that GoG said about Zahard could be altered. My personal theory is that everything the GoG said about Zahard was about V, and that's why the GoG is so confused about how Zahard changed so much. He didn't change - the memories he has were about V but the one who he sees now had a totally different goal to V. Also, I think the reason why Zahard's symbol is in the cave is because that's also the symbol of V - Zahard is using that symbol now but it was originally V's. If Viole is the Prince of Zahard, and V is Viole's father, then V could also be a Zahard. V seems like a first name while Zahard seems like a second name, so I predict that V and Zahard are brothers - they are both Zahards. The eye of Zahard is therefore a symbol of both V and Zahard, and Viole can be the true Prince of Zahard since he's the son of the True King, V.

 

And here's proof that GoG's memory was altered:

TOWCpCog.jpg

 

 

I was aware that their memories had been altered when I posted, and I knew that you would mention that. I will go wit the fan translations because LINE sucks, it says"

Zahard and the 10 Family Heads did everything to erase the records about you and Arlen. / All buildings and records related to her were destroyed

They even manipulated Workshop-affiliated records and the memories of artificial lifeforms. / But fate cannot be changed."

 

Their memories have been altered, but altered to erase V and Arlen from story, not modified to change V into Zahard in GoG's mind, speculation about that is possible but it is  most likely not the case. Zahard is the one who wanted to be king, it's confirmed by Garam, GoG said the same. GoG said he wanted to be king because he wanted to be above the others, when Baam went for his revolution who did he met? The demon, who was trying to make him accept him. This fake wanted Baam to get stronger in order to be above the others, which is the same goal Zahard had when he trained with GoG. We can infer from this that Zahard chose the delib and never found his true self, from this point he changed for the worse, Arlen was also against Zahard's decision because she said he had changed, so this too is confirmed. If you say that Zahard was in fact V it means that V was in the wrong as well. And in Garam's story he didn't want to be king, he just wanted to climb higher. He was an irregular and climbed with the strongest, don't you think that if he was supposed to be the king he would have survived? He ended up killing himself, unable to stop his leader and unable to protect baby Baam. Why did the God decide to resurrect Baam and not V if he was meant to be the king?

 

Enryu was probably talking about his master when he said king. V won't be more important than Zahard in this story, he has less weight that Arlen as well so far(the G of FUG is from Grace, Luslec, who was a servant of Viole even has the name Grace). When the warriors were climbing, Zahard was the protagonist, but he got corrupted while climbing the Tower. He is a fallen hero.



#47
Prince of Zahard

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I thought that there is no real "king" of the Tower.

It's just a title Zahard invented for himself after he decided to "rule" Floors 1-134. Which, for all we know, may not even be 1% of the actual number of Floors.

 

But even if you are right succession rules, historically speaking, are rather fluid.

There have been too many cases where the siblings of the deceased ruler have had equal, maybe even greater, claim to all relevant titles and lands than the ruler's children.

So, Zahard may just as well be the "true king".

 

Valid points.

 

The reason I think V was a King is mostly due to Luslec. We know at least that Luslec saw V as his King. Therefore, he would see Viole as his Prince. The question is whether that's simply a Prince, or a Prince of Zahard. They may not be the same thing. When I made this theory, the entire premise is based on the idea that Viole is the Prince of Zahard. For me, it has always made more sense that Viole is the Prince of Zahard. Since I believe that Viole is the Prince of Zahard I then tried to explain how it may be possible given all the new information we've discovered in recent months. If Viole turns out to not be the Prince of Zahard at the end of this Season, then the theory is dead.

 

Anyways, I'd explain it like this: the Zahard's were royalty even before they entered the Tower. V was either a King of the Crown Prince of a kingdom outside the Tower. For some reason, V, Zahard, and their soldiers entered the Tower. Initially everyone had the same goal of climbing to the top of the Tower and having their wishes granted. But, as they got closer and closer Zahard and the other Great Warriors didn't understand why they should leave. The reward for climbing the Tower is said to be the ability to wish for anything you want... but, they noticed that they could obtain everything they wanted in the Tower itself. By utilizing contracts with Administrators, they could even become immortals. So why would they want to leave the Tower? V, however, ignored the temptations of the Tower and resisted accepting contracts. He insisted that they continue to climb the Tower. But for Zahard, that was not an option. Zahard convinced the Great Warriors to stay in the Tower and they agreed, abandoning V and making Zahard their King.

 

However, factions in the Tower still exist that remember V, the true King. Luslec, one of V's closest associates was outraged by Zahard and his treachery. He founded FUG, possibly with Arlene's help, and waited for the day that Arlene's son, Prince Viole would appear in the Tower. The Great Warrior Gustang may be regretting taking Zahard's side after what happened to his daughter. Repellista may be connected to some sort of faction that has been waiting for Viole. The reason why I think Wangnan being the Prince of Zahard is a red herring is because I just don't see why they would have had him waiting on the 20th Floor for so long and not have utilized him in any way like his brother, Karaka. Wangnan is obviously connected to Zahard in some way, but since he's not unique in that he has siblings I don't see why the season would be called 'Return of the Prince'.



#48
Shinsoo Beam

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V and Zahard are/were brothers? that would literally make baam the Prince of Zahard



#49
Sh1royuki

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Just read Line WEBTOON new ch. 244 official release.
One thing that still didn't make sense to me:
Rachel tried to hard to avoid meeting Baam since they were in 2F.
They (Rachel and Yura Ha) knows Baam's team did not have the location of the thorn, since Yura had to offer to share the 'Riddle' (the only clue they had on the location) as a deal to get away from Koon/Baam.
Hell Joe practically announced that he had the thorn (well, he lied, but Rachel wouldn't have known that).
Then, just because Emily announced that Hockney (who was NOT looking for the thorn but looking for his picture) is heading to Spirit Room with Baam, Rachel suddenly goes "Baam is going to Spirit Room, the thorn must be there, we must go there"..??
Now.. how did she suddenly jump to that conclusion?
I'm guessing she & Yura could not decipher the riddle, thus offered it to Koon on purpose hoping they would lead them to the thorn, and leaving Hockney with Baam's team because Hockney will give them locations via Emily.
But still it's quite the jump to suddenly want to go chase after Baam (when she had tried so hard to avoid him) and go where he is, and therefore she concluded the thorn must be there??
Emily didn't announce anything about thorn, for all she knows, maybe Hell Joe really has the thorn and Baam was going to the wrong place.
It's true that they got that 'riddle' from Hockney, but Hockney probably had no clue he was being used via Emily and he himself was not looking for the thorn, had no clue he was heading to thorn location, and did not even know that Baam was looking for it until they met Deza.

Wangnan is obviously connected to Zahard in some way, but since he's not unique in that he has siblings I don't see why the season would be called 'Return of the Prince'.[/size]


Well, I was wondering about the same thing. "Return" would have meant somebody who was there before, gone (missing/disappeared) or otherwise, and the come back. And so far, only Baam fits the "Return" part. He was the main character, missing/presumed dead, then reappear/return to the story/plot/friends. As for WangNan, he was not in S1, he didn't literally 'disappear', he was just stuck in 20F trying to pass the test. So how can "Return of the Prince" be referring to him?? If S2 is about WangNan, shouldn't the title be "The Existence of the Prince"? Since S2 is when we know about the existence of Zahard's mistake (the unofficial "Prince of the Red light district").

#50
gemaddog7

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I know what I said earlier about the thorn..but honestly..Rachel being weak is part of the fun, her getting the thorn and becoming stronger when 99% of her character arc is getting by on wits and manipulation..just *feels* wrong, y'know?

 

 

She's a fun character because of how she *contrast*  Baam, not being Baam. It's just..hard to see where we go other than this, I would like if she remained climbing the tower the way she has. It's where she's so interesting..the problem with this is just, how long can someone useless keep using other people in a series where things get progressively more dangerous. Know what I'm saying?

 

Her being strong..just feels like it defeats the *purpose* of her character, but you know..characters evolve..so her purpose will evolve with her I guess. But she's gotten everywhere she is now completely and entirely because of her head and being at the right place at the right time, she herself said that she was good at scheming and organizing things where they needed to be when. She is the contrast of Baam, who has gotten where he is because of himself and has been manipulated *by* other people the entire way up, instead of *using* them. A strong Rachel throws what makes her such a great character out the window and kills some of the contrast she was with Baam.

 

 

She has no power whatsoever, she's the weakest character in the series, and yet she's climbing the tower just as fast as our record breaking protagonist because of getting lucky and using people. It's what makes Rachel..Rachel.

 

I don't know how I feel about this development of her character so far with the thorn, but we'll see. 

 

Edit: Eh..if she manages to get the thorn herself, maybe it keeps her arc intact. I do still disagree with everyone's complaints about Baam *letting* her take the test though, he's both giving her an oppurnitity and allowing her the opportunity to achieve something on her own. In helping her, he is putting her behind him. He's not whining about her betraying him or telling her he will help her climb the tower,  he directly acknowledged that she was his enemy. This is the most development he has *ever* had *against* his obsession with Rachel.


Edited by gemaddog7, 04 April 2017 - 04:41 AM.


#51
AquaTama

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I know what I said earlier about the thorn..but honestly..Rachel being weak is part of the fun, her getting the thorn and becoming stronger when 99% of her character arc is getting by on wits and manipulation..just *feels* wrong, y'know?

 

 

She's a fun character because of how she *contrast*  Baam, not being Baam. It's just..hard to see where we go other than this, I would like if she remained climbing the tower the way she has. It's where she's so interesting..the problem with this is just, how long can someone useless keep using other people in a series where things get progressively more dangerous. Know what I'm saying?

 

Her being strong..just feels like it defeats the *purpose* of her character, but you know..characters evolve..so her purpose will evolve with her I guess. But she's gotten everywhere she is now completely and entirely because of her head and being at the right place at the right time, she herself said that she was good at scheming and organizing things where they needed to be when. She is the contrast of Baam, who has gotten where he is because of himself and has been manipulated *by* other people the entire way up, instead of *using* them. A strong Rachel throws what makes her such a great character out the window and kills some of the contrast she was with Baam.

 

 

She has no power whatsoever, she's the weakest character in the series, and yet she's climbing the tower just as fast as our record breaking protagonist because of getting lucky and using people. It's what makes Rachel..Rachel.

 

I don't know how I feel about this development of her character so far with the thorn, but we'll see. 

 

Edit: Eh..if she manages to get the thorn herself, maybe it keeps her arc intact. I do still disagree with everyone's complaints about Baam *letting* her take the test though, he's both giving her an oppurnitity and allowing her the opportunity to achieve something on her own. In helping her, he is putting her behind him. He's not whining about her betraying him or telling her he will help her climb the tower,  he directly acknowledged that she was his enemy. This is the most development he has *ever* had *against* his obsession with Rachel.

Are you seriously saying that Rachel is a fun character...Have you been reading the same webtoon as me dude?

We are not complaining about him letting Rachel in on the test...We are complaining about the overly friendly atmosphere between the two...


Edited by AquaTama, 04 April 2017 - 04:47 AM.


#52
Lester

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I do still disagree with everyone's complaints about Baam *letting* her take the test though, he's both giving her an oppurnitity and allowing her the opportunity to achieve something on her own. In helping her, he is putting her behind him. He's not whining about her betraying him or telling her he will help her climb the tower,  he directly acknowledged that she was his enemy. This is the most development he has *ever* had *against* his obsession with Rachel.

And in doing that, giving away an immensely powerful item that he needs to be able to deal with his own business. His own strength is simply not enough, and even he acknowledges as much. He's being stupid here. Again.



#53
gemaddog7

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Do you know where it's explicitly stated that Zahard is the one who opened the door? I have a strong feeling that V opened the door and Zahard is a "false king" that kinda stole everything from him. It would explain why Luslec followed V as his King but it wouldn't explain why the Great Warriors would side with Zahard over him. It would also mirror the relationship of Rachel and Viole where Rachel's literal goal is to steal everything from Viole; his purpose, his friends, his life.

 

I also refuse to believe Wangnan is the Prince of Zahard and the only other candidate is Viole - thus his father, V, being the true king makes more sense to me personally. If V is the true King then the true successor is Viole, not Wangnan and his sibling(s).

Problem with making Rachel mirror Zahard is that, judging from Rachel's right now and where Zahard is uhhh...he seems a whole lot more competent to me. Rachel's a bum, who used nothing but other people and her brain to get where she is. Zahard is the strongest man in the world(besides Enryu and Phan), the most famous man of all time, the man whose blood created him a legion of super strong trophy wives. Him stealing that from V would show a level of competence Rachel hasn't ever shown up to this point.  How do you even steal something like that? Interesting thought though, because I have been rambling on about the fact that Rachel is still a main character. Considering SIU's track record with killing people, nevermind main characters, she's probably the least likely character to die along with Baam.

 

Just doesn't seem to roll right narrative wise.  I can't imagine Baam wanting to be any sort of the king. The only thing he has ever wanted was *any sort of human interaction*, if season 1 hadn't ended the way it did..well Baam would be dead, but hypothetically speaking he'd just climb the tower with his comrades. It's just that everyone else in the tower wants very different things for him and neither are nice.

 

 No, I just meant "fun" in the sense of "interesting", fun in the way Hoaquin is. Not the way Rak is.


And in doing that, giving away an immensely powerful item that he needs to be able to deal with his own business. His own strength is simply not enough, and even he acknowledges as much. He's being stupid here. Again.

Not only does he already have a thorn piece, but there is another on the floor and two elsewhere. Besides, not exactly like he ever wanted this..the only reason he's where he is now is because the same people delivering the thorn to him were threatening to kill the only people he had ever known.

 

It's really important to acknowledge the difference between him helping someone get a thorn and allowing them the opportunity to get a thorn, it's two very very different things. Compare letting her take the test alone to taking the submerged fish hunt with her to understand what I'm trying to say. It's very different, truly.



#54
GreatBlackDragon

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There is not enough information about Wangnan to say that he is not unique. His past is a mystery. But so far, he is the only weak character with Zahard's blood.

 

Just read Line WEBTOON new ch. 244 official release.
One thing that still didn't make sense to me:
Rachel tried to hard to avoid meeting Baam since they were in 2F.
They (Rachel and Yura Ha) knows Baam's team did not have the location of the thorn, since Yura had to offer to share the 'Riddle' (the only clue they had on the location) as a deal to get away from Koon/Baam.
Hell Joe practically announced that he had the thorn (well, he lied, but Rachel wouldn't have known that).
Then, just because Emily announced that Hockney (who was NOT looking for the thorn but looking for his picture) is heading to Spirit Room with Baam, Rachel suddenly goes "Baam is going to Spirit Room, the thorn must be there, we must go there"..??
Now.. how did she suddenly jump to that conclusion?
I'm guessing she & Yura could not decipher the riddle, thus offered it to Koon on purpose hoping they would lead them to the thorn, and leaving Hockney with Baam's team because Hockney will give them locations via Emily.
But still it's quite the jump to suddenly want to go chase after Baam (when she had tried so hard to avoid him) and go where he is, and therefore she concluded the thorn must be there??
Emily didn't announce anything about thorn, for all she knows, maybe Hell Joe really has the thorn and Baam was going to the wrong place.
It's true that they got that 'riddle' from Hockney, but Hockney probably had no clue he was being used via Emily and he himself was not looking for the thorn, had no clue he was heading to thorn location, and did not even know that Baam was looking for it until they met Deza.

Well, I was wondering about the same thing. "Return" would have meant somebody who was there before, gone (missing/disappeared) or otherwise, and the come back. And so far, only Baam fits the "Return" part. He was the main character, missing/presumed dead, then reappear/return to the story/plot/friends. As for WangNan, he was not in S1, he didn't literally 'disappear', he was just stuck in 20F trying to pass the test. So how can "Return of the Prince" be referring to him?? If S2 is about WangNan, shouldn't the title be "The Existence of the Prince"? Since S2 is when we know about the existence of Zahard's mistake (the unofficial "Prince of the Red light district").

 

 

Hockney is a native, the one who found a piece of the Thorn and the best D rank Scout. Assuming that the Thorn is there is logical. She avoided Baam because Baam wanted to make her leave the Tower. This time she had no choice, Karaka is a Ranker and she wants the Thorn for herself, Karaka could beat Baam and take the other piece as well. Going to meet Baam and try convince him to leave was the best option. If Baam had not learned about Arlen and her past he would have probably followed her.


Edited by GreatBlackDragon, 04 April 2017 - 06:11 AM.


#55
PaleKing

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I know that Zahard gave half of the key to Ashwul Eduardo, but does it say anywhere before the ring reveal that he gave a single piece of a object to him, as in could he also have forged the rings?



#56
AquaTama

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Since we just got info on the 13MS i feel that the rings will take a long time to reveal even a little info on then so i'm not so interested as you guys on them...More than the rings i want to know just how strong White Oar is...Since it's the only weapon of the highest rank...Also i'm interested in Mago...I wonder how they're like


Edited by AquaTama, 04 April 2017 - 06:08 PM.


#57
GreatBlackDragon

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Since we just got info on the 13MS i feel that the rings will take a long time to reveal even a little info on then so i'm not so interested as you guys on them...More than the rings i want to know just how strong White Oar is...Since it's the only weapon of the highest rank...Also i'm interested in Mago...I wonder how they're like

 

We are going to learn more about the rings before we get to Mago or White Oar, for sure. They are the signature weapons of clan heads. And SIU doesn't even want to reveal their faces.



#58
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Is there a translation for the latest leaked chap?


I have alwavs found that Angels have the vanity to speak of themselves as the Only Wise. This they do with a confident insolence sprouting from systematic reasoning.
W.B


#59
Sh1royuki

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Hockney is a native, the one who found a piece of the Thorn and the best D rank Scout. Assuming that the Thorn is there is logical. She avoided Baam because Baam wanted to make her leave the Tower. This time she had no choice, Karaka is a Ranker and she wants the Thorn for herself, Karaka could beat Baam and take the other piece as well. Going to meet Baam and try convince him to leave was the best option. If Baam had not learned about Arlen and her past he would have probably followed her.


Well, I was referring to when she saw Emily's notice on Hockney going to Spirit room and said she must go to where Baam is, Before she was overheard by Hoaqin and Karaka. True, Hockney is a native, but so is Hell Joe and many others in FoD, plus it was not confirmed that she knows Hockney found the thorn before, we only knew that recently from Mata, who had to tell Hockney about it because Hockney lost his memory. The only thing Hockney knew before this new revelation was that Hell Joe was hunting him because he refused to help Hell Joe. Since Emily's info on FoD came from Hockney, it's doubtful that Rachel would know about it before Hockney himself does.

Anyway, I see your point.. but even if Baam had not learned about Arlen, he wouldn't have followed her, the old him would only leave if she is leaving with him, and Baam knew she was telling him to give up on everything and leave on his own, she wasn't going to stay with him, she was just getting him out of the way before he got caught by Karaka, and also so she could get to the thorn before Karaka does.
The old him might have asked if she would leave the tower with him. The new him, just cut thru the crap she was saying and concluded she wasn't doing this out of concern for him and just wanted him out of the way, no need to ask/wonder if she would leave with him anymore.
Rachel was hoping Baam would just listen like he used to before they went to the tower, she wasn't expecting him to say no.
Although I wonder what Baam was thinking when Rachel came in behind them claiming she was worthy of the thorn and that Baam was the thief.

#60
AquaTama

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Well...Honestly...All this talk about Wangnam and Karaka is really boring as they are...Since they are the only ones with rings so far i kinda wanted SIU to just skip everything about then...