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Mangaka's against Batoto. Poor move mangakas...


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#1
Master_Aricitic

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"Shueisha has requested us to not to host his title and its chapters. Please do not upload." <-Please note, this contains a typo. "his" should be "this". The confusion resulting from this typo is obvious.

 

​You know. In a country where it is legal to basically plagiarized, as defined in practically every other country and every other industry, the authors/artists of Manga (Mangaka) are apparently fairly stupid.

Every good entrepreneur knows that it is an absolute must to 'diversify', one doesn't simply put all one's money into a single stock and expect to make lots of money. More likely than not this would lead to a financial loss rather than a gain.

And yet, a Mangaka personally requested their manga be removed from a non-profit website. This is just stupid. <-This is where the confusion is. Practically everything else still works regardless of Mangaka vs Publisher.

Even the gaming industry has been learning over the past fifty years that it is utterly impossible to squash the hackers and people who illegally download video games. You kill off one group, two more pop up in its place (or a vastly higher number than that).

Telling Batoto, again, a completely non-profit hosting site, to not host this manga is stupid.

While it is certainly true that Nisekoi has been hosted elsewhere already, there is no guarantee that those sites won't become for profit sites... assuming they aren't already.

​Batoto has 'one' advertisement, and that ad is solely to help pay for the server cost. This ad is on the main page. If you don't go to the main page but directly to the manga you wish to read you can completely miss it. Other sites have a minimum of ten, on each page... including each page containing the image of a manga page.

Batoto is an honorable website. While I have some issues with how it is run, that is mostly in the poor definitions given about banning procedures (basically the same thing as America's "I'll know it when I see it" stance on pornogrophy, which is utterly stupid.)

 

As I was saying earlier. Any good entrepreneur knows to diversify. Even the oil industry is beginning to branch out into other forms of income.

​The ones who should be scared aren't the Mangaka, but the magazines that 'legally' host their Japanese versions. Once mangaka discover that they can make a lot more money a lot faster and more reliably by hosting the scanned images online, they will be able to leave their sometimes cruel overlords and continue writing what they wish freely... for as long as they wish, or as long as people continue reading.

Will there still be problems with people hosting unauthorized copies? Yes, but with the electronic age -- and especially the internet -- this issue will never go away. The so-called 'dark net' is real, and things that were once used only by people doing extreme illegal business often trickles down to people doing 'less illegal' things. (i.e. if governments are 'encouraged' to violate their citizen's rights by monitoring the internet in the way some companies want, we'll just find less legal and more secure ways to get what we want.)

 

So, what's my point in all of this? Mangaka (perhaps not magazine companies, but mangaka) should be cherishing the non-profit hosters of manga. More than that, they should either be making their own, or making business deals with the ones that exist to make a cut of the income.

If, instead of requesting (read 'demanding') Batoto to remove Nisekoi from Batoto, Shueisha asked for advertisements to be placed on this page and perhaps some of the pages with the actual images, and to receive 60, 70, 80 or 90% of that income, I am fairly sure that Batoto would have either agreed or simply done what it has already, i.e. removed the manga. That would have been a smart business investment. Not removing it from a trusted source, one of, likely, thousands of host sites.

Batoto is not mangafox. Batoto does not profit off of other people's work. Batoto respects the requests of not only the authorized producers, but also the not-so-authorized (read illegal) ones as well. Anyone who doesn't recognize Batoto as not being a threat likely deserves their content to be distributed by less trustworthy people.

 

Finally, just an FYI: I'll likely modify this post in the future to add, remove or correct things. This may be based on people's responses or on my own discoveries.

 

And a final note: I don't have the monies to buy the 'legit' Nisekoi brought to America. Even if I did I would have to compare the 'legit' version with the fan translated versions. Recently... no, as far back as the inception of bringing Manga or Anime to America, American companies have been abusing the original works by adding, removing, or changing things. This has gotten so bad in some cases that I am beginning to feel the need -- not the urge, the need -- to only read/watch fan translated versions to get the 'best' experience, or at least the closest to the original experience. This, naturally, includes all of the errors, poor quality, and other mistakes made in fan translations.

Basically, I would nearly rather go to jail than support what I see as an atrocity to manga, anime and the Japanese culture in general committed by ignorant American companies.

 

(An example: Hulu, an authorized provider of "Kinzoma" an Anime about [and I quote from Hulu]: "When Shinobu was still in middle school, she had the opportunity to study in England while living with a host family as an exchange student. And while that happened many years ago and she doesn't do well in English class, she still loves the English language. When Shinobu learns that the daughter of her host family, Alice Cartelet, is coming to stay with her and study in Japan, she’s thrilled. But will Alice be able to fit in with Shinobu’s Japanese schoolfriends, Youko and Aya?"

This show is rated TV-14, even on Hulu it is shown as rated TV-14... and yet before each and every episode there is a "Mature Content Warning".

At first I was stumped, I even opened a ticket with Hulu to report the 'bug'. But I have come to realize that it is because of some extremely subtle LGBT content -- i.e. the two main characters act somewhat lovey with one another, but are not in a relationship, outside of pure friendship; additionally one of the friend 'sub-characters' has 'feelings' for the other friend 'sub-character'.

This is a show likely intended for youths or adolescents in Japan... But in America it is rated Mature on Hulu. We're just lucky they didn't butcher it like what was done with Sailor Moon when it was originally brought over...

If this is the way America treats the content it brings from another country, then I would rather experience it from the 'true fans' who do their best to remain true to the original, rather than appease the insane/idiotic masses -- or their perception thereof.)


Edited by Master_Aricitic, 11 May 2015 - 07:24 PM.


#2
Redpandamaniacal

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How exactly did you determine that the mangaka asked for this? Was there news somewhere? If it's solely off the description, it appears that there's just a typo with "this" being replaced by "his."

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shueisha

 

Shueisha is a publishing company, not a mangaka.



#3
Master_Aricitic

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Thank you for the correction. While that certain does change things I still assert that it is a bad move, and that mangaka should try publishing online, especially those who are well liked.

I will modify my post tomorrow as I am currently using my phone.

#4
KobatoChanDaiSuki

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well it could have been like Aomizuan (hentai CG making group/artist) which didn't ask to have his work translated into english and upload to a certain website, just said

 

"Thank you very much for reading the works created by Aomizuan. I’m glad to have an international reader base that enjoys my work; however, uploading unauthorized editions of my work to the internet constitutes copyright infringement. As an author, if I don’t make money, it’s difficult for me to keep working. But it's also difficult for me to stop every illegal upload. So, I encourage all of you who enjoy my work to purchase this translated version."

 

and just put a link where you could buy his works online (yes, digital ver. no paper.)

We need total bros like him...


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#5
GodricKharg

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Disappointed to see it removed.  However, It might have been smarter to instead leave the first 3 chapters (not a full volume) in place for those curious to read.  Could drive sales?  I dunno, Just a thought that removing everything is unwise.  "Its called a loss leader" ;)


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#6
Forgotten Muse

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May I at least ask why you can't put away $10 (the cost for a volume where I live, roughly) in a month or two? Is it a job thing or?

And a final note: I don't have the monies to buy the 'legit' Nisekoi brought to America. Even if I did I would have to compare the 'legit' version with the fan translated versions. Recently... no, as far back as the inception of bringing Manga or Anime to America, American companies have been abusing the original works by adding, removing, or changing things. This has gotten so bad in some cases that I am beginning to feel the need -- not the urge, the need -- to only read/watch fan translated versions to get the 'best' experience, or at least the closest to the original experience. This, naturally, includes all of the errors, poor quality, and other mistakes made in fan translations.

Basically, I would nearly rather go to jail than support what I see as an atrocity to manga, anime and the Japanese culture in general committed by ignorant American companies.


Edited by Forgotten Muse, 11 June 2015 - 09:19 PM.

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#7
daraghuman

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May I at least ask why you can't put away $10 (the cost for a volume where I live, roughly) in a month or two? Is it a job thing or?

The main problem is that most of the manga the everyone else reads are weekly in magazines (even some monthly) rather than in a tankoubon. If you have to wait for the tankoubon release you are already behind by some chapters which makes you feel left out talking to people who are up to date. Now if the manga industry hosts lets say something like a central site instead with a $5-10 subscription sure most are willing to pay that if they get translated and up to date mangas.

 

That is also another problem since translated mangas are VERY VERY behind which is the reason why most mangas are translated by translation groups.



#8
Drakan

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May I at least ask why you can't put away $10 (the cost for a volume where I live, roughly) in a month or two? Is it a job thing or?

That can be different for most of us, for me it's usually because these are only available in the US and my country has a crapload of tax when you want to order stuff from outside, on the other hand, english isn't my birth language, I make due with it on batoto because it's usually what's available (lots of good spanish groups though, but there's just not as many as english scanlators, and I can't imagine what it is like for the other languages), I don't mind reading manga in another language, but if I'm paying to have it translated I do expect to pay for a translation to my language.

 

And yes, I do hate that they have chapters in all languages taken down when they start an english translation.


Edited by Drakan, 14 July 2015 - 03:39 AM.


#9
ivoSF

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mangaka that are well established are often made that by publishers.

and while online self-publishing is in an uptrend, it make no sense for them to japordize their relation with the publishers who made them a living just for some extra online profit.

(besides there are such things as contracts and publishing rights)

while i like to read manga here just as everyone, i do know it is only posseble becouse it does`t really impact the japanese domestic market.

let be glad for what we can read nowdays compared to 10 years ago.

 

im sure all those big company`s are aware of sites like this.

the reason they ask to remove certain series instead of lawsuits like in the past, seem to indiacate they do know its good for promotional purposes.

but when they can make an extra penny from those series that ARE popular enough outside of japan, of course they will ask for removal from time to time.

to me complying with this seem to be a small price to pay for this tolerance.

 

 

 

GodricKharg, your idea is indeed a good one, but it my experience big companies usual dont pay much atention to finesse.


Edited by ivoSF, 19 December 2015 - 02:52 AM.