13 replies to this topic

[Fragile]

And we're all upset because we're only on volume 8, haha.

 

P.S. Love Hina had flying turtles, a language revolving around turtles called "Pararakelse", anime samurai, magic, and the most AMAZING plot devices...

 

INTERNATIONAL DATELINE GUYS

 

We never, ever, ever, see Hinata-obaa-san's face... ever...

[Lazuemon]

Sorry, I'm not sure what Love Hina's volume count has to do with Nisekoi's volume count. Though Nisekoi isn't too far away from reaching 14 volumes itself, 29 chapters until Chapter 120.

They're completely different stories by completely different authors - even the childhood promise aspect is completely different. The only thing they have in common is the romantic-comedy genre. It makes no sense to compare them.

[dahh]

Sorry, I'm not sure what Love Hina's volume count has to do with Nisekoi's volume count. Though Nisekoi isn't too far away from reaching 14 volumes itself, 29 chapters until Chapter 120.

They're completely different stories by completely different authors - even the childhood promise aspect is completely different. The only thing they have in common is the romantic-comedy genre. It makes no sense to compare them.

You completely missed the point for this comparison

[Lazuemon]

You completely missed the point for this comparison

 I did, huh? Point it out for me, because I'd say the same thing about any two other manga each penned by different mangaka.

[M.A.D]

Sorry, I'm not sure what Love Hina's volume count has to do with Nisekoi's volume count. Though Nisekoi isn't too far away from reaching 14 volumes itself, 29 chapters until Chapter 120.

They're completely different stories by completely different authors - even the childhood promise aspect is completely different. The only thing they have in common is the romantic-comedy genre. It makes no sense to compare them.

 

Not just the genre, they share the same beginning plot element as well. A late bloomer who doesn't date girls because he's too focused on the girl of his childhood promise, and yet somehow later he ended up with a lot of pretty girls who's all in love with him. Oh, and they don't remember each other, either. Even the childhood girl in both manga have similar personalities, and also both are referred to as monkey at one point. If the plot can be more similar than that, it'd be borderline plagiarism. 

 

 I did, huh? Point it out for me, because I'd say the same thing about any two other manga each penned by different mangaka.

 

I'm not sure myself, but I think I can digress.

 

The point of comparison is that Love Hina ended after 124 chapters, during which time it had introduced us to flying turtles, mecha-turtles, turtle-fearing samurai, turtle island, etc... It had a rich amount and diversity of plot elements and story, comprising of long arcs that takes us anywhere from becoming terrorists on a train to defeating cursed swords in Kyoto. 

 

On the other hand, Nisekoi is only 29 chapters away from where Love Hina finished, and the end is nowhere near in sight. We have made only one major breakthrough, which is getting Chitoge to admit that she likes Raku. But nothing else.

[GreenToes]

Not just the genre, they share the same beginning plot element as well. A late bloomer who doesn't date girls because he's too focused on the girl of his childhood promise, and yet somehow later he ended up with a lot of pretty girls who's all in love with him. Oh, and they don't remember each other, either. Even the childhood girl in both manga have similar personalities, and also both are referred to as monkey at one point. If the plot can be more similar than that, it'd be borderline plagiarism. 

 

 

I'm not sure myself, but I think I can digress.

 

The point of comparison is that Love Hina ended after 124 chapters, during which time it had introduced us to flying turtles, mecha-turtles, turtle-fearing samurai, turtle island, etc... It had a rich amount and diversity of plot elements and story, comprising of long arcs that takes us anywhere from becoming terrorists on a train to defeating cursed swords in Kyoto. 

 

On the other hand, Nisekoi is only 29 chapters away from where Love Hina finished, and the end is nowhere near in sight. We have made only one major breakthrough, which is getting Chitoge to admit that she likes Raku. But nothing else.

So, what you're telling me is to not read this manga?

[Lazuemon]

Not just the genre, they share the same beginning plot element as well. A late bloomer who doesn't date girls because he's too focused on the girl of his childhood promise, and yet somehow later he ended up with a lot of pretty girls who's all in love with him. Oh, and they don't remember each other, either. Even the childhood girl in both manga have similar personalities, and also both are referred to as monkey at one point. If the plot can be more similar than that, it'd be borderline plagiarism. 

 

Except, the promises are still wildly different, so what's this of plagiarism? Keitaro and Naru promise to go to Tokyo U, while here in Nisekoi, Raku and the mystery girl promise to open the pendant and get married. The difference? Keitaro and Naru got married on their own in the end of Love Hina, no story-opening promises of wedlock. And how do we expect the other girl to not remember Raku when we still don't know who exactly she is, if she may not be Marika?

 

 

The point of comparison is that Love Hina ended after 124 chapters-

 

But we can't say for sure that Nisekoi is going to end on 124 chapters. It could go longer (which wouldn't be a surprise, considering...), or it could end by chapter 114, for example.

 

-during which time it had introduced us to flying turtles, mecha-turtles, turtle-fearing samurai, turtle island, etc-

 

All I get from this is that Nisekoi isn't a Turtle Manga. Not exactly the best argument of comparison, since it leaves out things like Su on the night of that moon, for example.

 

It had a rich amount and diversity of plot elements and story, comprising of long arcs that takes us anywhere from becoming terrorists on a train to defeating cursed swords in Kyoto.

 

Terrorists on a train...what? When?

 

However, yes, Love Hina indeed had diversity. But then, in a story with a powerful sword-wielding girl, a mad scientist loli and flying turtles, how could anyone expect any less?

Nisekoi is a simple romcom at the end of the day, unless we later get hit by Genre Shift out of nowhere. Trying to compare the two series is really an exercise in futility, because the extremes Love Hina had, Nisekoi doesn't and likely won't. I mean, it'd be a million times easier to try and compare Love Hina to Inaba Rabbits.

 

On the other hand, Nisekoi is only 29 chapters away from where Love Hina finished, and the end is nowhere near in sight. We have made only one major breakthrough, which is getting Chitoge to admit that she likes Raku. But nothing else.

 

Becoming the Mask wasn't really ever a breakthrough, it's a given in a romcom such as this. The breakthrough I'm thinking about that could've been pounced upon is 4 Keys and the relation to the Zawsze in Love children's book.

[pijoed]

If you ask me...... all I want is that Raku is reverted back to the original Raku back in the one shot. Why? I am tired of all the mcs in harem manga has the exact same characteristic. It feel like they are all clones. Are all these harem manga' s editor is actually the one same guy?

[rion134]

If you ask me...... all I want is that Raku is reverted back to the original Raku back in the one shot. Why? I am tired of all the mcs in harem manga has the exact same characteristic. It feel like they are all clones. Are all these harem manga' s editor is actually the one same guy?

 

well you see this clone types have been tested and proven for over for hundreds of mc characters that it does work for the industry and has been the formula for good mc for harem mangas ever since...

 

if they make the mc any realistic we get ourselves a hentai harem mc manga....

 

but sometimes this hentai mc characters do cross over to this kind of manga, and you know what the industry do when they spot this anomaly they kill them off just like the guy on school days.... to bad for him huh....

[maffa]

The similarities between Love Hina and Nisekoi are all there for anyone to see. 

Naru and Chitoge are both violent tsundere, much stronger than their MCs, that can send him flying with single punches. Even several points in their graphic designs are similar.

In LH we had Motoko, in NK we have Tsugumi: both warriors and martial, serious, in love with the MC despite despising him for his weakness, them being tsunderes as well.

In NK we have  Onodera, which is the fusion of two LH characters, the sweek and innocent Shinobu as character and the role of Mutsumi as the most obvious choice as the person of the promise. 

In LH we have Kitsune, in NK we have Maiko: both the witful rascals of the party. 

 

The childhood promise is almost the same as plot mechanism, as well as the uncertainty of the identity of the actual girl the MC made the promise to. Also, all the potential candidates converge on the same spot, together with those who wouldnt stand a chance because are not part of the childhood past but harbourr feelings for the MC engrossing his harem. 

 

Then yes of course exagerations in LH were off the charts, while NK keeps lower even though it cannot be call realistical (people sent flying with punches, walls breached by kicks, strenght reducing drugs, etc. just top of my mind), and yes Raku has a more balanced relationship with Chitoge than Keitaro and naru, and has so many redeeming points more than Keitaro which was a hopeless dolt and a tool, the inn in LH was very central plotwise with all that concerns living together and having to act as the inn's manager, as well as the outside bath was. but those central points are really in the open, no one can deny those. 

 

Maybe the smiliraties are so obvious to us because im-in-love-my-childhood-promise-but-i-be-damned-if-i-remember-who-the-fuck-she-was harem mangas arent tha many yet, but perhaps in the future there will be a zillion more and we will just consider all these elements as tropes instead "it's just a tad short of plagiarism" elements. 

 

 

All this by saying that i get the point of the OP totally, and that im sick and tired of all these fillers (if they dont have Tsugumi as the main character, as i did with Motoko in LH, those i enjoy)

[pijoed]

well you see this clone types have been tested and proven for over for hundreds of mc characters that it does work for the industry and has been the formula for good mc for harem mangas ever since...

 

if they make the mc any realistic we get ourselves a hentai harem mc manga....

 

but sometimes this hentai mc characters do cross over to this kind of manga, and you know what the industry do when they spot this anomaly they kill them off just like the guy on school days.... to bad for him huh....

Hate to disagree but there is a great harem manga without this particular similar traits...... and they're not hentai manga either

 

1-Kami~sama from TWGOK

2-Death note, lol...... bet every one don't expect this

3-GTO, lol.... even my big sis agree

4-Negima, lol..... for some reason i do think it is different compare to those clones coz 1 thing for sure is dat the mc being naive come from him being 10, not coz he stupid.

Edited by pijoed, 09 June 2014 - 07:56 AM.

[Avs]

Step 1: Draw hot girls that appeal to the tropes that mindless manga/anime consumers have all come to know and love. (boobs, flat chests, blond hair, foreigner, childhood friend, crazy families yakuza).

Step 2: Create MC that's male (so you can put it in shonen jump) who isn't ugly and has some plot device that doesn't make him instantly try to have a relationship with every hot girl that falls into his lap (reality blows).

Step 3: If initial plot/story is strong enough, extend until money isn't coming in anymore. The key/lock arc has been discussed one of the best arcs in this series (it was...legit enough to tie the characters together).

Step 4: When fans start to balk at how slow and shitty the plot has become, add new girls.

Step 5: When simply adding new girls isn't enough, go for the curve ball, such as new family member, long lost sisters, etc.

Step 6: If everything is failing, time skip/time travel, goddesses, just make shit up since that's what the author has been doing since they clearly didn't plan out the arc enough.

Step 7: Abruptly retire/end the manga with a terrible conclusion AFTER the a few seasons of anime done by SHAFT which from episode 1 resorted to using SHAFT style production from monogatari and zetsubosu etc over and over until you wonder if the anime is anything more than pretty art with no real style.

Step 8: Post on some random website bitching about all this shit.

Step 9: Meta post on the post about this shit.

Step 10: Necro this thread two years from now when this manga has finally run its course and people have grown a little bit older and realized how shitty this was.

 

Damn...

[lorddx22]

still like that part you put with the author adding in more hot girls.  Makes it a comedy/etc which i find enjoyable

[M.A.D]

So, what you're telling me is to not read this manga?

 

It's been been 7 months, but just in case you ever come back here: I'm not telling you to read or not read anything. That decision is yours alone. I was merely explaining somebody else's opinion.

 

Except, the promises are still wildly different, so what's this of plagiarism? Keitaro and Naru promise to go to Tokyo U, while here in Nisekoi, Raku and the mystery girl promise to open the pendant and get married. The difference? Keitaro and Naru got married on their own in the end of Love Hina, no story-opening promises of wedlock. And how do we expect the other girl to not remember Raku when we still don't know who exactly she is, if she may not be Marika? [/quote]

 

These are plot elements. Of course they are different. What we've been comparing is the plotline. The structure to which the plot adheres to no matter what element is introduced.

 

But we can't say for sure that Nisekoi is going to end on 124 chapters. It could go longer (which wouldn't be a surprise, considering...), or it could end by chapter 114, for example.

Nobody's saying that Nisekoi's ending after 124 chapters. Even a baby can see that it's not happening, at the current plot rate. What we have been talking about here is that in comparison of one manga to another, Love Hina was full of plot even though it was obviously shorter. On the other hand Nisekoi was longer but seriously lacking content.

 

All I get from this is that Nisekoi isn't a Turtle Manga. Not exactly the best argument of comparison, since it leaves out things like Su on the night of that moon, for example.

*sighs* Look... just... Love Hina was more interesting. That's what the OP has been saying, OK?. The level of creativity and diversity of plot element and structure that was put in it has given it more depth than Nisekoi, which mainly gave us chapter-by-chapter jokes so far.  

 

Terrorists on a train...what? When?

That'd be Suu shooting rocket missles

 

However, yes, Love Hina indeed had diversity. But then, in a story with a powerful sword-wielding girl, a mad scientist loli and flying turtles, how could anyone expect any less?

Nobody expected less from Love Hina. It was great as it is. However, people expected MORE from Nisekoi, because it begins the same way Love Hina did, and captured its audience with the same feel as Love Hina has given them. Those who have once loved Love Hina would have recognised the elements right away, leading them to have great anticipation and expectations of the same diversity and creativity that they had enjoyed with Love Hina. However, that expectation was not met, as Nisekoi remained a school life comedy gag manga

 

Nisekoi is a simple romcom at the end of the day, unless we later get hit by Genre Shift out of nowhere. Trying to compare the two series is really an exercise in futility, because the extremes Love Hina had, Nisekoi doesn't and likely won't. I mean, it'd be a million times easier to try and compare Love Hina to Inaba Rabbits.

Finally, you spoke of the right subject. I was beginning to lose hope there. And yes, you're right. It's futile to compare them, but that doesn't stop people from trying

 

Becoming the Mask wasn't really ever a breakthrough, it's a given in a romcom such as this. The breakthrough I'm thinking about that could've been pounced upon is 4 Keys and the relation to the Zawsze in Love children's book.

  

 

In that case, that means Nisekoi never made a breakthrough to begin with. This strengthens the point with which I used Chitoge's self-realisation as an example. That is, Nisekoi has too slow a pace and too little substance comparing to Love Hina. 

Edited by M.A.D, 11 July 2014 - 08:28 PM.