28 replies to this topic

[Starbuck]

But even if that is my opinion the add network providers won't care about that. And something like Batoto can't be realistically run without adds.

thx
at least this make much more sense, than talking about "society morals".

I was expecting it, so why not checking the nationality of Batoto.com membership.
ad placement is not restricted to the US only. nor has it to be registered there.
And due to its network with the scan teams, Batoto.com has the potential to offer a real value for international exposure.


Best regards,

[Trebor]

thx
at least this make much more sense, than talking about "society morals"

That's actually what I've been saying the whole time. I guess you just didn't understand me.

I was expecting it, so why not checking the nationality of Batoto.com membership.
ad placement is not restricted to the US only. nor has it to be registered there.

That's not how our ad system works, and until we find a better alternative to suit the unique needs of this site, it won't change.

[Terrabane]

Guess I must be blunt. We have a policy. A policy that will most likely not change. What you see is what you get. Nothing's really stopping you from using a different reader either.

Regards,
Elro.

Ok this isn't the issue of using a different reader or even of the policy that is in effect. This is about a somewhat arbitrary ruling over a manga that has no overt nudity but is locked because of (this is an assumption of course) because of the nature of the topic content. It stands to reason that while the over all understanding is that you are constrained by the policies of the company who pays the bills so to speak. This is understandable, but what is arbitrary is the fact that while the topic content is highly sexual and of different nature than supposed "normal" relationships it has been locked.
I edit one of the series in question, I DO however understand the why that series might have been locked as while it isn't sexual in nature there are excessive amounts of nudity being shown. The other series in question, being the main storyboard named Nana to Kaoru which is billed as an ecchi high school exploration into S&M shows suggestive sexual themes and the various slice of life scenarios of a pair of teenagers who are exploring that issue. There is no nudity in the series(at least none that I recall off hand) but it none the less was locked. The general thought is because it is bondage orientated and this is the arbitrary ruling of which I speak.

[Trebor]

It's not an arbitrary ruling, it was highly sexual. See the guidelines that I linked to in my first post.

[Terrabane]

It's not an arbitrary ruling, it was highly sexual. See the guidelines that I linked to in my first post.

While you are the site admin and it is not my intention to argue if you go by the guideline of high sexuality you can knock roughly 70% of every echhi manga off the list that you post. Ecchi is supposed of a sexual theme while not actually going into the actual act.. I'm sorry for being contradictory and it is not my intention but as with anything I have a different outlook in such regard and am simply stating such.

Edited by Terrabane, 15 December 2011 - 03:37 AM.

[Trebor]

I can appreciate that you don't agree, but objectively, Nana to Kaoru has pretty hardcore stuff.

Ecchi does not mean "sexual theme whithout actually going into the act." By that definition, everything is ecchi unless actual penis or vagina is shown. Ecchi means sexually suggestive, but not overtly. Ecchi is stuff like a guy wants to chase after girls' skirts or steal panties.

Nano to Kaoru is the guy getting the girl off, and it shows the sexual act in great detail. There is a definite difference there. You can't claim that Nana to Kaoru is the same thing as ecchi or that it's the exact same as other ecchi comic.

In any case, the rule will not change for the reasons stated. I'm only trying to help you understand a) what the rule is b) how it's applied and c) its rationale. We do not arbitrarily lock comics. We do it based on relatively objective criteria. This, of course, will always be somewhat subjective, but we do the best that we can to be objective about this.

[soranokira]

I just want to clarify some counter-arguments made against my post.

there is a whole world outside the US, unless you forgot it.

the standards in the world generally conform to the US standard to some extent due to US being a superpower (even if it is a somewhat declining one right now)

then don't speak about their plans as if you knew them for sure.

They did mention they had plans that's all, I'm just stating what I know and my views about this topic, just like you. And by taking a stand that is relatively defensive for batoto it is somewhat inevitable that my posts may somehow appear like I'm representative of batoto, which I'm stating that I'm not.

in Velvet Kiss, there is sexual intercourse between the protagonists
in Nana to Kaoru, there is sexual play (not intercourse !!) between the protagonists
in Magico, there is sexual attraction between the protagonists

since you can split them into 'levels', there'll be those which are within acceptable levels and those outside, that level is adjustable and subjective.

by adopting a policy too restrictive in regards to hosting non-sexually sensitive manga

you find it too restrictive, while others don't.

[Starbuck]

the standards in the world generally conform to the US standard to some extent due to US being a superpower (even if it is a somewhat declining one right now)

Hahaha

I don't know where you live mate, but get out for your own sake
when it comes to morality, the US is in a world of its own that is different from the other 7 billions living in this planet.
you do realize, the US is like 4% of the world population, right ?

sure, through trade globalisation, different cultures interact and share their own values.
some US citizens might find themselves more at ease with some other liberal-minded or conservative-minded countries, depending of the issue or the segment of your population.

But no, the US doesn't set other countries "morality" : in this vast world, you are seen as loons, better kept at bay than too close.

when it comes to violence, you are more easily compared to fascist and authoritarian regimes. US prison culture and death rows have more in common with slave labor practices in soviet goulag or communist china, than with rehabilitation-minded nordic countries. and the craziness of allowing (almost) unfettered access to firearms ...
when it comes to sex, you are seen as a paramount of hypocrisy, well-suited to the likes of the middle-east, Iran and Saudi Arabia for the censorship, while actually behaving like an over-crazed latin country.

and don't get me started about the US brand of democracy.
the only democracy that seems to be, is for the working-class to keep working, in getting poorer and more vulnerable. While representatives are voted in office by an ever-decreasing share of a polarized and extremist population, where money and business relations are the main deciding factors.


To summarize, you might not like hearing it in a crude way, but outside the US borders, the US is seen as a joke.
And personally, I don't subscribe to the "declinist" view : the developping world is fragile enough and rife with so many internal imbalances, that the US has more than enough ressources to ride it above for a very long time.
except that it is no "shining city on the hill", "beacon of democracy", "land of brave, home of the free", all that kind of cheap propaganda ... at least not, when you check the league tables.
on the other hand, if you want to compare yourself with countries like North Korea for economic liberalism, or Chechnya for fair rule of law, or Somalia for democratic representation, then I'm sure you can be proud of the US ... so are 150+ odd countries


Best regards,

[mhh]

I don't like how this discussion seems to go around in circles when everything was already said.

Fact is our advertising network does still not care even if you continue to argue.
Fact is that advertising network has strong ties to the US and it's rules are in line with the US legal standards.
Fact is also that some groups have gotten in trouble with ad networks because of their content.

Topic closed.
If you still think a comic is unjustly locked you may ask here, that's why that topic was made.
Any other complaints: send me a PM.

Edited by mhh, 15 December 2011 - 08:13 PM.
Seen, understood. Edited so there is no confusion.