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Are paramecia the stronger fruit for endgame?


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#21
Jannic

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Very interesting argument! I still think that Luffy's ability to keep standing is what makes him strong, and yes, being a rubber-paramecia helps him with that...but if he was at his current power level (Dressrosa) and instead of 'Gum-Gum Hawk Rifle' it was 'Entire Gigantic Volcano Hawk Rifle' or 'Completely Freeze Someone's Blood In Their Veins Gatling' he'd, in most general cases, be stronger. But there's more to it than non-specific 'power levels' vs. mooks he might hypothetically fight. I mean, in terms of crowd control/dueling I still feel Mihawk/Shanks (normals) could take almost all the DF users we've seen, at least 1v1, and have huge AoE with few drawbacks.

 

The thing about this series is that luck is a superpower. When Luffy survives execution, all Smoker's reaction establishes that it's literally a sign from the heavens that he has a grand destiny. (I know Dragon was there to get it done, but what were the odds that they'd both be there at the same time and willing to expose himself like that, etc.?) Repeatedly (against Enel and Lucci most obviously) his specific, weird powers (rubber, hard to punch) are exactly what are needed for the challenges in his way. Not to take anything away from him, he works hard and is a beast in battle and I love him, but his biggest similarly to Gol D. Roger is that both have a child's nature and the devil's own luck. I mean, Haki is basically just "The Concentrated Power of Being Really Determined and Awesome", so this series is all about metaphysical personality stuff having real power.

 

So his Paramecia? Exactly what he needed in the future, ideally suited to his psychology ("Punch bad people! Then keep punching!") so the universe put it in his way. Just like it set him on a series of trials that give him new abilities in a gradated fashion, provided him an elite Haki teacher, introduced him to genius allies...all the usual coincidences of Shonen manga are, I believe, specifically stated in this series to be Luffy's in-story power that 'fate is on his side'. Even when he is outclassed (Ace's execution) he manages by unbelievable luck to get away in a manner that ends up with him stronger. 

 

So Paramecia vs. Logia, and even the level of one's Kung Fu, aren't the big deal - it's Haki, which is basically Luck + Will + Batman, which Luffy has in spades because the gods want him to inherit Roger's throne.



#22
jrusse18

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So Paramecia vs. Logia, and even the level of one's Kung Fu, aren't the big deal - it's Haki, which is basically Luck + Will + Batman, which Luffy has in spades because the gods want him to inherit Roger's throne.

I agree with most of what you said except I don't understand how luffy is Batman



#23
Hyakuju

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I agree. I can definitely see that. 



#24
ltnlng

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The point Oda is trying to make is that you don't need a powerful fruit if you yourself are powerful. Roger didn't have a fruit and became the Pirate King. Mihawk and Shanks both don't have fruits and they are the strongest swordsman and a yonkou, respectively. Oda is espousing the idea that you should rely on yourself.


Regarding the Mythical Zoans - I do agree that they are rarer than Logias, but they are not a DF type. They are a subtype of one of the types - Zoan. I would compare it to, let's say, the fiery subtype of Logias like Mera Mera and Magu Magu. But the whole discussion seems a bit meaningless at this point. It all boils down to semantics, which is not my favourite thing to argue about. biggrin.png

Paramecias are certainly interesting and there are many hidden gems amongst them. However I do not agree with your illustration of Logia user's development. There certainly is a plateau at which they are stuck in the beginning (I liked this page), but there is a lot of room for improvement.

Regarding the bounties ranking, it does not represent the actual strength of the individuals. Bounties are not power levels.

A funny fact - Luffy's intentionally made to have a goofy ability, Odachi said he wouldn't like his main character all serious and whatnot.

To further answer OP, the two strongest guys we know actually do not have any DF abilities - Gol D Roger and his first mate Rayleigh. The third strongest is probably Garp back in his prime and he also do not have a DF.

Gol D Roger and Whitebeard are the two strongest we know... And Garp is presumably stronger than Rayleigh; he is most likely on par with Roger. I don't know where to rank Sengoku and Shiki, but the two are definitely around Gol D Roger's level. 


Edited by ltnlng, 07 September 2014 - 01:50 AM.