Noblesse vs Tower of God

Noblesse repeted itself and its plot (that was never good to start with) until i droped it (tun tun tun tunz). I really don't think this manhwa is in some sort of "another level". Kiss Wood; Shin Angyo Onshi; Id; A Fairytale for the Demon Lord and of course, Tower of God, are way better in so many aspects that I really don't need to explain. Noblesse seems like the japanese Clamps, but with more bishounens (yeah, its possible) and have a little bit more of fan service.

Yes you do, otherwise people (including me) will not take your post seriously. I've read most of those (Id, A Fairytale for the Demon Lord, and ToG) and I don't see how they are soooo superior to Noblesse as you claim them to be...

Edited by infamous, 14 November 2012 - 11:50 PM.

I dont really think that noblesse art is superior to tog . Realistically Tog's art is better .

Yes you do, otherwise people (including me) will not take your post seriously. I've read most of those (Id, A Fairytale for the Demon Lord, and ToG) and I don't see how they are soooo superior to Noblesse as you claim them to be...

At least some form of story development unlike the constant . Omg an elder appears . Fight him with your super powers

Edited by Arie Hon, 15 November 2012 - 12:08 PM.

I want to make one thing clear and I'm pretty sure I said it before, I love ToG. ToG has a lot of mysteries and questions that I can't wait to be answered. There is a lot of hype, mainly because of SIU's blogs which contains a lot of information about characters that have yet to be revealed, different factions that have to have achieve their goals, etc...But couldn't another reason for this hype just be because the manhwa only 118 chapters so far. We are not that very deep into the plot and because of that, many people are anticipating what will happen in the future. There's nothing wrong with making theories, but some people actually think they know what will happen as if they have looked through a magical crystal ball or something lol. In my opinion, it's 100 chapters too soon to compare this to a series that has lasted a lot longer, especially one that has more than twice the amount of chapters. 258>118, c'mon now.

At least some form of story development unlike the constant . Omg an elder appears . Fight him with your super powers

Umm...We haven't seen any of the main cast have any contact with the elders until the 12th appeared, which was around chapter 229 I believe. I don't count Crombel, because he obviously has motives different than the rest of the Union. But yea, I think it was chapter 229, and right now we are at chapter 258, so I don't know how you came to the conclusion that the entire story revolves around "Omg an elder appears. Fight him with your super powers"....

Edited by infamous, 15 November 2012 - 04:51 PM.

Both are entirely different kinds of stories, in terms of art, narrative structure and overall plot. To say one is better then the other is like saying that apples are better fruits then grapes. There's really no basis for claiming it other then personal taste

Both are entirely different kinds of stories, in terms of art, narrative structure and overall plot. To say one is better then the other is like saying that apples are better fruits then grapes. There's really no basis for claiming it other then personal taste

Yup, pretty much just common sense, isn't it? How, and why, would you compare apples and oranges, other than simple personal preference? Oh well, the debate continues.........

I was reluctant to reply to this conversation, but I felt the need to make one point because I haven't noticed anyone allude to it (if you have I'm sorry I missed it). I won't comment otherwise on which comic I think is 'better' because they are both very different and there are aspects I prefer about both (even though there is one I like overall more than the other, but I would not feel 100% comfortable calling that anything other than personal opinion rather than something I can factually argue).

Noblesse is written and drawn by two different people. Tower of God has the same author and artist. As such, it is not completely fair (in my opinion) for so many people to compare the art of the two webtoons.

You may argue: "but so many incredible mangas/manhwas/etc. out there have the same author and artist and have both great art and great stories". It's not that I am implying someone can't be both very good at drawing and very good at writing. However I think it's true that it will be rarer to find one person who is very good at two different things, so Noblesse has the advantage in that sense that they can be sure to find two people who are very good at what they do: one at writing and one at drawing, while Tower of God relies on one person to do both, and judging from the comments thus far I think the majority is leaning towards SiU's main strength being writing.

You may counter: "but it is easier for the author to be their own artist because they know exactly what they want to be expressed". I can't really argue this point, I'm sure it is true, but I am sure there are limits to this argument as well because many comics out there with a different author and artist have shown how they work together, and the storyboards that the author gives the artist seem pretty good to me, and you can't really deny that if someone is being selected to work on a project purely on their art skills that the writer must like them and feel they can work well with them. While it may not be as seamless a process, the audience/readership probably won't really notice any discrepancies since we don't know any better, so all we can really do is compare the quality of art.

Thus, comparing the artwork of someone who was selected because of their art skills to someone who may be good at art but is even better at storytelling will almost always end in a result tipping in the favour of the artist.

What I also observed ? The Batoto ToG's community is the only one better than Noblesse's community. In any other forums where both are treated in the same way Noblesse has better ranks. I'm not saying that Noblesse is better than ToG, just saying there is not fair treatment.

That's because Noblesse is *older* hence has more subscribers.

Noblesse was the gateway Manhwa series for a lot of people (except me mine was Trace), and sort of acts as the default *manhwa* series in most forums, including on NF, where Noblesse fans later introduced me to ToG.

However(AFAIK, correct me if I am wrong), on Batoto, ToG is the main series because it *started* by ToG scanlators! Grumpy and Co did ToG, decided add a forum to it, and *later* decided to open the forum upto other series, including Noblesse.

So obviously there will be disparity, but that doesn't necessarily mean a bias; On other forums, Noblesse fan long been established, so they represent the manhwa scene; however, Batoto was made by ToG fans, so obviously they lead the board here, because they were all this board had earlier on, noblesse is younger on Batoto.

====

As for the Nob vs ToG debate let me say this:

*Nob *has* great art *now*, but the earlier art was weird. But now, yeah, Nob Art FTW
*Nob's story is fomulaic, and the suspense is not in *what* will happen, but *how* it will happen (10/10 Franky pwns, but *how*?)
*Nob is an action series, less intrigue more BAM BAM KABOOM
*Nob uses art to capture our imagination and place us in the scene; great art (not just the drawing, but things like the choice of angle to *draw* the scene) means greater inclusivity. We can visualise frankly pwning an elder in front of our eyes.
*Nob has suffered a change of focus (remember the school kids? remember when they were relevant and actually *participated* in the plot, and even GASP fought? Yeah, the good old days)
*Nob is suffering power level fatigue (too many power ups, which must be topped by further power ups, making it an arms race)
*A character in Nob is more likely to fight than to scheme

ToG:

*Crappy art, feels rushed and inconsistent, artist sometimes forgets how characters looked (Exhibit 1: Quant)
*But artist makes me ignore it by focusing on the plot.
*EXTREMELY well thought out plot; minimal plot holes, very detailed verse.
*Consistent power levels; a regular will NOT overpower a ranker, and no amount of heroic-will will change that.
*Extremely weak plot shields, your favourite character *will* die, except if they are slated to die later.
*Genuine Intrigue: ToG fans genuinely have *no* clue what will happen in the next chapter. We can guess, but we have no confidence our guess will be right.
*No Arc Fatigue; ToG avoids dragging the story *too* long, and ends it usually quickly without it feeling *too* quick.
*A character in ToG is more likely to scheme than to fight.


TL;DR:

Nob:Art::Tog:Plot
Nob:Brawn::ToG:Brain

At the end however, If I had to choose, I would prefer Plot over Art, and hence ToG wins.

@ryzvonusef

True, the TOG bias here is indisputable. Not that differences in the popularity of particular series is only limited to TOG and Noblesse from reader site to reader site, but there's no question that TOG is going to have the inside track here.

Well go to EGS Forums, members there will provide you hundred reasons why its better than the rest.(There is NO Support group, join it if you are too obessed with Noblese). I know both ToG and Noblesse are dufferent, and also ToG is undefeatable in this Forum no matter what offencive stance we take and how powerfull it is.

Stories are of generally two types, character deriven and plot driven.
Noblesse is a story derived by its characters, which I find really interesting and personally I find maximum of characters to be original for a shonen story.
ToG is a story dervived by so called "complex and intriguing" plot . And well the characters are hardly any original for a shonen manga. Same generic personalities and attitudes. But it has so called intriguing plot which is the reason for its thousands of fanboys and fangirls.
This is my personal opinion- I really dont find ToG's plot to be that complex and interesting. Maybe I dont find it that interesting and complex after reading many fantasy stories. On other hand,Noblesse driving force-its characters, they are different from your generic stories.

(Check out Easy Going Forums, and make a thread there about this...they will provide more points to support Noblesse. Batoto is ToG's headquarters and EGS is for Noblesse.)

A debate never ends, and no one wins it....

I agree that comparing both ToG and Noblesse is silly. Both are great in their own unique ways. Although truthfully, I do feel like I lean more towards Noblesse, just because it is more character driven (like strixflash mentioned above) rather than plot driven (like ToG). I don't know what it is but I just like character driven series more than I do plot driven ones. Although that is not to say that just because one series is character driven and the other is plot driven, it doesn't mean that they are lacking in the other categories. Anyways, it's just a matter of preference, I guess.

As for the art, I don't really think that art should be a major factor on whether or not you enjoy a series more or not. The story/characters is more important and when you get sucked in, for me, I just forget about the art. I like both ToG and Noblesse so I probably have a different opinion compared to those who have read one or the other but since I enjoy reading both, I don't really concentrate too much on the art for ToG or Noblesse (unless of course, it's like Hunter x Hunter where the art is just so bad at one point that you can't help but be distracted by it).

There are a lot of websites that post Noblesse and Tower Of God, and I don’t mind saying this is the only one I have see that puts TOG at the top of the most popular list, most don’t even have it in their top 20.

That said I still like it better

Edited by sorrow, 28 November 2012 - 09:46 AM.

It is to early to compare them, if its ever good to do it... ToG is plot based without much 'all round development', it is still in stages of developing the story because it still young. Noblesse however is a narrowly focused story because od the character type of story, which means it does not means the same type of deep that ToG needs, this also attracts two different types of readers, giving a biased opinion because of the differences of the preferences of the reader. Art and character wise Noblesse wins and ToG has superior plot... The plot in Noblesse is as obvious as ToGs characters are generic and boring... One and only one character in the story has dept and originality in it. Where as Noblesse has about the same kind of + in its story with a lot of the Union and the traitor clan leaders (except one) still u known and the Werewolves yet to enter the stage, so overall it is just like aany reader of both would say.
Noblesse: Art(8-9/10 imo) Characters (9/10, Franky 1000/1000, just wanna say it) Story (5/10, because of the first parts with the children mostly) Plot (3/10, so far to obvious)
ToG: Art(4/10, sloppy and show signs of a new unexperienced art writer, characters are boring) Characters (3/10, Rachel saving it) Story (~8-9/10, bit to much of a generic tragedy where someone tries to help another) Plot (10/10, sadly 10 is max point for a category, SIU is the best ploter in history-imo!-)
Total N 25,5/40 Tog 25,5/40 ... I would say that N is better even though scores are the same because the art matters alot in drawing in new readers and the ToGs early art repulses many readers before they can get to love the amazing story and the infinitee amount of future possibilities and because ToG has to maintain its plot at a high lvl, where it is easier to maintain the art and characters that alrdy is built and introduced and also is older which makes it more widespread and not to mention it is also often stated it to be the started of colour manshas giving it a special kind if status. I have tries to be as non-biased as possible and since i am a big fan of both it should weigh up for it, i hope.

Lastly: i am writing this in the dark with an iphone and it is rather hard to keep track of grammar and spelling, so please forgive any eventual mistakes I did in writing this rather large text

It's close, I'd have to give it to ToG though, just because how much wider the world is, and how much deeper SIU has made that universe.

My top Web Comics are...

1- Tower of God
2- Noblesse
3- The God of Highschool
4- Girls of the Wild's
5- Magician

Noblesse was better in the beginning when it was funny, now it seems like it's just DBZ blowing stuff up with super powers.
TOG was better in S1, S2 is completely unfocused and seems to be doing nothing half the time.

It's been said many times here, but objectively comparing those two is nearly impossible since they are so different in terms of style that it gets down to a matter of "taste" and personal preferences. I read them both, and like them both, for different reasons.

I really dont find ToG's plot to be that complex and interesting. Maybe I dont find it that interesting and complex after reading many fantasy stories. On other hand,Noblesse driving force-its characters, they are different from your generic stories.

I don't really agree with either of your statements here. You may find that ToG's plot is not interesting, and you have a right to this opinion, nothing in this world can appeal to every one of us, but that the plot is not complex? There is possibilities for so many endings when put out of context. It became even more true when you link it to the Talze User storyline.

As for Noblesse characters, they really are the driving force behind it, Frankenstein is just fabulous and the others as well. And I disagree with those that compare to Nobless to DBZ. While the ennemies do power-up, it's much more realistic in the sens that they slowly draw attention to Korea by climbing the power ladder (from small fries to the named bosses) and gaining momentum by doing so. And the main characters don't power up, Frankenstein and Rai were badass from the start. But I don't find them all that "original". They remind me of Kenichi's masters (overpowering and fighting with beings on the same level more or less), the rest of the gang being like Kenichi and the Shinpaku Alliance, slowly powering up by being trained/genetically helped by Masters/Frankenstein. Sure the dynamique behind it is different. But it's not really new (at least in my opinion).

on witch is better tog or noblesse it doesn't really mater if you like one or the other is totally up to you so saying one is superior to the other is your own opinion i like them both same goes with the art style
one thing that you guy have yet to discuss is how shinwoo has left the scenes of noblesse and have become nothing more than comic relief while his charcter is the most intriguing that the only thing that bothers me in noblesse

Edited by gus, 21 November 2012 - 11:44 PM.

They are great, but I don't think they are in a level above others, there are many good manhwa out there that are as good or even better than them. I'm not comparing, but I enjoy reading Magician, Kubera and, for now, Feng Shen Ji, way more than reading Noblesse or Tower of God, but if I were to choose one, I would pick ToG, I simply enjoy it more than Noblesse.

Edited by Kahn Marley, 26 November 2012 - 03:45 PM.

. While the ennemies do power-up, it's much more realistic in the sens that they slowly draw attention to Korea by climbing the power ladder (from small fries to the named bosses) and gaining momentum by doing so. And the main characters don't power up, Frankenstein and Rai were badass from the start. But I don't find them all that "original". They remind me of Kenichi's masters (overpowering and fighting with beings on the same level more or less), the rest of the gang being like Kenichi and the Shinpaku Alliance, slowly powering up by being trained/genetically helped by Masters/Frankenstein. Sure the dynamique behind it is different. But it's not really new (at least in my opinion).

The most irritating, senseless and idiotic comment I have ever read. Comparing whom to whom? Even stupidity should have a limit.
Ok, it looks like your comment really worked for irritating me even though that wasmt the purpose, but seriousley.......

You sound like a little kid patting yourself on the back without even getting anyone’s approval to do so.

About Idea being much more important : I have 2 manga set of ideas in my head much more better than those in Noblesse and ToG but I don't think it will be easy to surpass them (or even compare to them). When I start to write my first novel my teacher told me I don't want many excellent ideas to write a good book , that I only need one.My first chapter had at least 5.

If you have an idea so much better than Noblesse PROVE IT! The internet makes finding good artists wanting to work on drawing for a great story childes play regardless of where you live.

I've read every single chapter of ToG and Noblesse. ToG is better, hands down.

The story of Noblesse is just so emotionless and token. Viscerally satisfying, granted, but it's not interesting at all. ToG is fresh and engaging, not to mention that the universe is huge and has ample room for expansion. The art is much better, and you can't tell whether a character is a good guy by whether he's a bishie or not. ToG is just better in every way, period.