Idol Pretender

@dark_shimoto,

My whole argument hinges on hormones, pheromones, and the psychology of the brain and why being a woman doesn't necessarily mean you'll need a man to be secure or fall in love. Which is why I brought up homosexuality and Chinami's feelings for Yuika. And for that matter: if estrogens and androgens flat-out determined your sexuality, why is he still attracted to Yuika? Just because he has more estrogen flowing through his blood now, it doesn't necessarily mean he'll suddenly be attracted to males. There are men suffering from gynecomastia--a disorder which prompts the growth and development of breasts in men. A primary cause is a drop in androgens, and a relative increase in estrogen. Does that mean those men suddenly become attracted to other men? No. Sex hormones alone don't determine what you're attracted to.

And the argument before the one you responded to was an attack on the author and his terrible use of the white knight cliche to set Oguri up as a possible love interest. Chinami can take care of himself. "Don't react violently because you won't be liked as an idol if you do?" That's nonsense--celebrities react badly to much pettier things; Chinami is being sexually assaulted almost every time Oguri has needed to intervene. Are you telling me that he can't kick a molester or two into the stratosphere without losing fans? He's already beaten one man to half-death on camera, and he's also kicked a large vase to smithereens with precision. If he was going to lose fans for being strong, he'd already have lost them.

This is tagged as a seinen manga, yet there's so much lack of afterthought and/or consideration for, I dunno, reality (as far as emotion, the mind and relationships go). This is definitely more shounen than seinen; barely any character development besides. His case might have changed, but the motherboard, GPU and processor are still the same.

At any rate, the people replying to me generally misunderstand one thing about my text wall: I don't care about his attraction to Oguri, that's not the problem. Nor am I confused about anything--I know why he's attracted to Oguri, and it's got nothing to do with sex hormones. The development of the relationship and the basis on which it's formed is just haphazard.

@Aereus,

We didn't know anything about Yuika before Chinami's sex change other than her being a fan of "The Way of a True Man," and liking manly characteristics in a person."Person," because she didn't reject the thought of liking a woman at all--which, to me, indicates that she's flexible in that regard.

Heh, Oguri gay. Heheheh.
See pg 37. That comment tickles me for some reason.

This is seinen, or maybe shounen... but definitely not shoujo.

@Soma You're the one I'm talking to.... sorry I didnt write in my first message .... sorry ........

He/She feels secure to Oguri ..... that what's made him/her attracted to Oguri..... You just said Oguri is like his/her knight and shining armor ...... Security can be a factor to like to someone especially women.....

I think this manga needs a shounen tag more than a shoujo tag.

tl;dr: The mind says "No, this is wrong!" "But that's forbidden love!" Etc... While the body+chemistry is saying "Oguri is a looker and he's always nice to me and...."

I think the funniest character change so far is Yuika. Chinami apparently "made her gay" for her when she previously wasn't "that way" presumably lol...

I don't get it, but, OMG, how is Chinami gonna get out of this!!!?

Actually, since he became a girl, his feelings is also gradually becoming of a girl. That's why he will be permanently stay as a girl for the rest of his life if he haven't buy the potion asap.

er... it has all types of relationships.. lol

why not both Oguri and Yuika? we'll get to see Yuri and straight romance at the same time

Can't you people just accept it as Chinami is now depending a lot more on Oguri for mental support and daily life than when she was a boy and that his care of her has developed a sort of Stockholm syndrome?

I'm genderblind so it works that way for me.

I see you guys are confusing with Chinami attraction towards Oguri. Let me get straight to the points:

1/ Certain people are underestimate the power of hormones. Yes, the brain is indeed the one who controls our body just like a president. But the Congress ( in our case: hormones) has fearsome power too. For example, when you are angry, you may say "blood went to my head"; I would say it's largely the hormone's fault.

2/ Chinami's current body is a female's. With a rack that big, there is no doubt the female hormones are overwhelming the male hormones (For those who don't know, both male and female has both testoterone and estrogen in their body but with different proportion). Nay, even the president cannot veto that, he may keep saying his idea but no one support him.

3/ Chinami is currently a perfect female not a transvetive, Oguri is a perfect male. There is no way in hell homosexuality is involved in here biologically. Mentally, it is homo; but biologically, it is not

Somehow i really feel myself supporting Vexed's idea of what Oguri is going to do.

@Kish Mirasol,

@purunporoppe, I hope you like diatribric text walls. :I

"Interest" does not necessarily mean "strong attraction." You can have interest in someone without being particularly attracted to them. It usually starts out as a desire to know more about the person, and then it escalates from there. How quickly it escalates, and how much you glean varies from person to person,

At any rate: that's my point exactly. It's not just about hormones or pheromones; nurture and nature play a large role in sexuality as well. I believe that you aren't suddenly shot out into the world as either heterosexual or homosexual, but that you develop that identity as you grow. So if that's the case: why do homosexuals exist?

According to Satinover, M.D., "[...] Homosexuality is...neither exclusively biological nor exclusively psychological, but results from an as-yet-difficult-to-quantitate mixture of genetic factors, intrauterine influences...postnatal environment (such as parent, sibling and cultural behavior), and a complex series of repeatedly reinforced choices occurring at critical phases of development." Yet Chinami clearly still has feelings for Yuika. The same, obviously, applies to heterosexuality. Chinami spent most of his life as a male. In that time, he determined what--specifically, who--he was attracted to, and carried that information over with the rest of his memories and sense of self to his present body. He didn't suddenly lose sight of his feelings for Yuika or himself. So suddenly becoming female won't just as suddenly erase years of heterosexual male hard wiring. Not unless the brain was wiped clean and he had to learn what to be attracted to again. But more than that: his very first reaction to Oguri in chapter 1 was that he was "creepy." It wasn't love or hate, just that the boy was "creepy." It's different from Yuika who didn't have an opinion of Chinami (male or female), or sexuality--apart from being attracted to "manly" characteristics (which women, too, can have).

So at this point, I feel as if the author is trying to reason that his change to a female would make it easier for him to notice and be interested in Oguri. Which, to me, is only utter bullshit because of the way it was developed. As far as Oguri being kind goes, if chapter 1 is any indication, Oguri has always shown concern for Chinami--which indicates that he's just a nice guy, if a little eccentric. So what changed between him losing a Y chromosome and gaining an X? Why would he suddenly let his guard down getting the same treatment peppered with the word "cute"? I won't even consider the fact that Oguri helped him; this isn't Tokugawa (or earlier) era Japan, there are laws that protect women. If he's being sexually assaulted and retaliates, no one will fault him for it--so what's with the bogus set-up requiring Oguri to White Knight the day away?

Again: my problem isn't with the fact that he's attracted to a male, it's why he's attracted to him and how that attraction developed over time that bothers me. It's ham-fisted writing at its finest.

But at least it's clear that he'll end up with Yuika, now. Or a To-Love-Ru-1-clear-as-mud-harem-ending.

Damn that loli has lot of trackers... she's an SSS-Class Stalker so even in hell she will find you XD

@Cydric
Yes, if the MC do as i say.
But, if the condition now continues, when the MC turn back to man again, i think it can happen.
Now i feel pity for the MC.

@Kelelawar

You don't thing if the MC becomes a man again, he won't have feelings for his roomate...right?

@purunporoppe : I agree. She likes Oguri because of natural instinct of her female hormone.

@Cydric
I think the MC (I don't even know what to use, he or she) is too full of the conflict(s) happening now.

But i think, if the MC is really focused to become a man again (and doesn't mind being an annoying bitch in the process) the MC will turn back to a man again quickly...

... and this manga won't be interesting, muhahahaha.

@Soma

I think even if it was biological (that is, attraction to males), it wouldn't necessarily mean he'd have shown interest in another man. Many heterosexual people don't particularly show strong attraction to the opposite sex, until they meet a particular person (or people).

In any case, say for instance that biologically, Chinami would now have a very slight attraction to handsome men. Even so, I think that his mental aversion would probably be enough to balance it so that he wouldn't feel anything. Mental aversions can be very strong, and I don't think that there's any way Chinami would be able to feel attracted to random handsome guys.
Oguri on the other hand is already trusted, is handsome (according to the characters), and has been only kind and reliable to Chinami lol, so I guess for that reason Chinami let his guard down?

I don't think it means Chinami was a bi or anything, from the start at least.

I wish Chinami-chan will NOT back to be a male! She just too adorable! Chinami (♀) X Oguri ending is fine.

Haruse Hiroki-sensei, please hear our wish!

I wonder...after all this, does the MC even want to turn back into male?

Idol Pretender is bi-monthly, so we get a new chapter every 2 months. Assuming Vexed releases at the same rate, that should be around mid-Sept then.